Some will find this reference interesting. An underlying assumption
for the patent seems to be the airplane is in coordinated flight.
Isn't that an uncomfortable assumption for most of you -- slips along
a straight track would go undetected as banks, wouldn't they?


United States Patent 5451963
Link to this Page: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5451963.html
Abstract: An apparatus for determining the bank angle of a moving
aircraft includes a receiver for receiving navigational signals from
NAVSTAR/GPS satellites in orbit about the earth, a signal processor
for demodulating the satellite navigational signals, an arrangement
for determining aircraft speed based on the navigational signals, an
arrangement for determining the rate of change of the aircraft track
heading from the navigational signals, an arrangement for determining
the bank angle of the moving aircraft from the aircraft speed and the
rate of change of track heading wherein the aircraft bank angle is
inversely proportional to the aircraft speed and directly proportional
to the rate of change of track heading.

On Feb 6, 6:40 am, "Tony" > wrote:
> Some will find this reference interesting. An underlying assumption
> for the patent seems to be the airplane is in coordinated flight.
> Isn't that an uncomfortable assumption for most of you -- slips along
> a straight track would go undetected as banks, wouldn't they?
>
> United States Patent 5451963
> Link to this Page:http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5451963.html
> Abstract: An apparatus for determining the bank angle of a moving
> aircraft includes a receiver for receiving navigational signals from
> NAVSTAR/GPS satellites in orbit about the earth, a signal processor
> for demodulating the satellite navigational signals, an arrangement
> for determining aircraft speed based on the navigational signals, an
> arrangement for determining the rate of change of the aircraft track
> heading from the navigational signals, an arrangement for determining
> the bank angle of the moving aircraft from the aircraft speed and the
> rate of change of track heading wherein the aircraft bank angle is
> inversely proportional to the aircraft speed and directly proportional
> to the rate of change of track heading.


Your turn coordinator is the same too. If you are uncoordinated you
could be in a bank and show level on the TC. Probably why the ball is
on the instrument. Staying coordinated is important in the clouds.

-Robert

"Tony" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Some will find this reference interesting. An underlying assumption
> for the patent seems to be the airplane is in coordinated flight.
> Isn't that an uncomfortable assumption for most of you -- slips along
> a straight track would go undetected as banks, wouldn't they?
>
>

Apperently current GPS's have a turn and bank indicator on them and they
work OK. But, I would like to see quantifiable data on the effect of
uncorrdinated flight and the effect of winds on this. I am thinking
coordinated flight errors will be smaller than wind errors. It take a HUGE
slip to generate a standard rate turn.

Danny Deger

"Tony" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Some will find this reference interesting. An underlying assumption
> for the patent seems to be the airplane is in coordinated flight.
> Isn't that an uncomfortable assumption for most of you -- slips along
> a straight track would go undetected as banks, wouldn't they?

I recall recently helping somebody on this newsgroup with the maths to work
this out.
Given that differential GPS is supposed to be accurate within cm I would
have thought that it would be possilbe to have GPS sensors on the end of the
wings , and the nose and tail for that matter to provide information about
the attitude of an aircraft that would be independant of whether the
aircraft was coordinated or not. . Or perhaps the cm accuracty only applies
in the horizontal plane?
terry

d&tm writes:

> Given that differential GPS is supposed to be accurate within cm I would
> have thought that it would be possilbe to have GPS sensors on the end of the
> wings , and the nose and tail for that matter to provide information about
> the attitude of an aircraft that would be independant of whether the
> aircraft was coordinated or not. . Or perhaps the cm accuracty only applies
> in the horizontal plane?

The accuracy is primarily lateral.

However, this exact method is used on some vehicles in order to
determine their orientation in space at all times. Obviously, it
works very well on aircraft carriers, somewhat less so on large
aircraft, and so-so on tiny aircraft. But it still works in any case.
Even a handheld GPS will show a change in coordinates as you move it
from one outstretched arm to the other.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

d&tm wrote:
> "Tony" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> Some will find this reference interesting. An underlying assumption
>> for the patent seems to be the airplane is in coordinated flight.
>> Isn't that an uncomfortable assumption for most of you -- slips along
>> a straight track would go undetected as banks, wouldn't they?
>
> I recall recently helping somebody on this newsgroup with the maths to work
> this out.
> Given that differential GPS is supposed to be accurate within cm I would
> have thought that it would be possilbe to have GPS sensors on the end of the
> wings , and the nose and tail for that matter to provide information about
> the attitude of an aircraft that would be independant of whether the
> aircraft was coordinated or not. . Or perhaps the cm accuracty only applies
> in the horizontal plane?

Is the patent applicant the guy who works/ed for NASA that was giving
out papers on this subject several years ago in the NASA Pavillion at
Oshkosh?

Sounds like a solution in need of a problem...

-Dana

On 6 Feb 2007 06:40:22 -0800, "Tony" > wrote:

>Some will find this reference interesting. An underlying assumption
>for the patent seems to be the airplane is in coordinated flight.
>Isn't that an uncomfortable assumption for most of you -- slips along
>a straight track would go undetected as banks, wouldn't they?
>
>
>United States Patent 5451963
>Link to this Page: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5451963.html
>Abstract: An apparatus for determining the bank angle of a moving
>aircraft includes a receiver for receiving navigational signals from
>NAVSTAR/GPS satellites...
--
--
If replying by email, please make the obvious changes.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Question Authority and the authorities will question you!

On 6 Feb 2007 06:40:22 -0800, "Tony" > wrote in
. com>:

>United States Patent 5451963
>Link to this Page: http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5451963.html
>Abstract: An apparatus for determining the bank angle of a moving
>aircraft includes a receiver for receiving navigational signals from
>NAVSTAR/GPS satellites in orbit about the earth,


The full text of the patent is available here:


http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=5451963.PN.&OS=PN/5451963&RS=PN/5451963
Inventors: Lempicke; Thomas A. (Rock Hill, SC)
Appl. No.: 08/249,803
Filed: May 26, 1994


It seems Mr. Lempicke has another more recent patent also:


http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=PALL&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsrchnum.htm&r=1&f=G&l=50&s1=5841370.PN.&OS=PN/5841370&RS=PN/5841370
US Patent Issued on November 24, 1998
5841370
Method and apparatus for determining aircraft bank angle using
satellite...
An apparatus for determining the bank angle of an aircraft and
method includes a receiver for receiving navigational signals from
NAVSTAR/GPS satellites in orbit about the earth, a signal
processor for demodulating the satellite navigational signals, an
arrangement for determining a sensitivity... 1998-11-24


I wonder why I was never taught that " ... winds can cause lateral
forces to affect the aircraft turning movement, tending to slip
the aircraft sideways."


From the summary:

An aircraft turns by banking which is caused by oppositely
deflecting ailerons. As the aircraft turns in a banking manner,
the pilot requires some visual indicator of the aircraft banking
attitude to coordinate the turn, maintain the desired course and
to safely operate the aircraft. The banking attitude is the
aircraft bank angle or angle of bank. Bank angle indicators are
common instrumentation in an aircraft and are sometimes combined
with a bubble/level device to form a combined instrument known as
a turn coordinator. The display associated with this device gives
the pilot necessary information regarding performance of a
coordinated turn. As the aircraft turns, winds can cause lateral
forces to affect the aircraft turning movement, tending to slip
the aircraft sideways. The rudder may be moved in correcting
response to lateral forces causing the aircraft to slip. The
lateral forces are displayed on the turn coordinator using the
bubble-type device similar to a carpenter's level. However, it is
the bank angle which actually defines the extent and rate of the
turn in coordination with aircraft speed. Current bank angle
indicators or turn coordinators are based on gyroscopes and use
the precession of the gyroscope in combination with a correction
factor to determine bank angle. The bank angle is displayed on the
turn coordinator using a tilting aircraft silhouette.