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-   -   Bush Flew Fighter Jets During Vietnam (http://www.aviationbanter.com/showthread.php?t=9683)

Bill Shatzer July 11th 04 06:44 AM


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in

The F-102A was area ruled.


I had thought that was exactly the problem with the F-102;
that it was NOT area ruled.

My quick and dirty reference (the one which most readily
falls to hand) indicates that the F-102 had a max speed
of 825 mph with a J57-P engine,

The F-106 is listed with a max speed of 1,530 mph with the
the same J57-P engine.

Something has to be going on there with the aerodynamics to
account for an 85% increase in speed with essentially the
same engine producing essentially the same thrust.



--


"Cave ab homine unius libri"

Ian MacLure July 11th 04 06:46 AM

(WalterM140) wrote in
:

[snip]

Some of these people want to say Bush got no special treatment, but I
don't know of any one who ever (at least since WWII) who got
lieutenant's bars without going through OCS or some sort of officer
qualification program. Bush went through a six week basic air man's
course, and then got a commission.


Was this a unique occurrence and can you prove it?

I think that Gore's father and Bush's father both had the same idea
in mind in the '60's. If their sons were going to have political
aspirations, they had to serve honorably. Gore did go to Viet Nam and
as far as I know, completely his service honorably and completely.


Shows ( once again ) what you know. Algore spent 90 days flying
a typewriter in a rear area to give his father cover during a
hard fought election then got yanked once the election was over.

He got a cushy job, so be it. But Bush DID NOT complete his service
honorably - his dad made sure that the records reflected honorable
service, but unfortunately for the Bushies, there is this one pesky
document that shows a conclusive 16 month break in Bush's service.


Cocnlusive to whom? To you? Ha! As if that matters.

Hopefully, more will be made of this in the coming months. Because
unlike Gore -or- Clinton, Senator Kerry served with distinction.


Not according to many of his peers in the brown water navy.
Kerry spent 120 days on station then got yanked.

IBM


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Ian MacLure July 11th 04 06:49 AM

(WalterM140) wrote in
:

Probably not since OCS is Army, not Air Force.

Next you will be telling us he never went to UPT either.


Did not/does not the Air Force have some sort of equivalent to OCS?
One that prospective second lieutenants go through?


Probably more than one at the time.

IBM

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Bill Shatzer July 11th 04 06:50 AM

Fred the Red Shirt ) writes:

Didn't the 102 have the downward firing ejection seat that
made low-level ejections, er, problematic?


Nah, it was "up and out" on the F-102.

But it wasn't equipped with the "zero/zero" ejection seats that
today's aircraft have - so low level ejections -were- problematic.

But then, F-102s tended to spend very little time at low altitudes.
Take offs and landings were pretty much the extent of that.

--


"Cave ab homine unius libri"

Ian MacLure July 11th 04 06:50 AM

(WalterM140) wrote in
:

[snip]

Senator Kerry is a decorated veteran.


KKKerry is a legend in his own mind. His colleagues are
less fullsome in their praise.

Bush skipped the last two years of his commitment.


Prove it! Otherwise belt up.

IBM

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Ian MacLure July 11th 04 06:53 AM

(B2431) wrote in
:

From:
(WalterM140)
Date: 7/10/2004 9:41 AM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:

Probably not since OCS is Army, not Air Force.

Next you will be telling us he never went to UPT either.


Did not/does not the Air Force have some sort of equivalent to OCS?
One that prospective second lieutenants go through?

Walt


Sure, it's OTS. Does it matter how Bush got his butter bars? The fact
remains he did.


And kept them. And made it through flight school without killing
himself or anybody else.
Or do you claim they just gave him his wings and pointed him at the
flight line? Wouldn't surprise me if thats your next claim.
And even if that was, by some warp of reality, what actually happened
he was at least able to fly a complex high performance airplane on
a number of occasions without any formal instruction. I would think
you'd be impressed with that level of ingenuity.

IBM

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Ian MacLure July 11th 04 06:55 AM

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
ink.net:

"WalterM140" wrote in message
...

Bush skipped out on the last two years of his commitment. That's one

problem.


The record indicates you're wrong. Again.


Well I think its safe to say that the only record those bozos are
interested in is broken and just keeps repeating the same old
off-key passage again and again and again.

IBM


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Ian MacLure July 11th 04 06:56 AM

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in
ink.net:

"WalterM140" wrote in message
...

Senator Kerry is a decorated veteran.


Yes, he earned some of his decorations. Nobody disputes that.


Yes indeed, some. But not all.

IBM

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Ian MacLure July 11th 04 07:13 AM

(WalterM140) wrote in
:

Sure, it's OTS. Does it matter how Bush got his butter bars? The fact

remains
he did.


Yes, and he got them the same way other ANG pilots got them.


ANG pilots were direct commissioned? All of them?


Your reading comprehension is faulty as well as your intellect.
Read the Ed Rasimus post carefully and note who DCs were intended for.
Note also that your notion of what OCS involved isn't even close.

IBM

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Ian MacLure July 11th 04 07:32 AM

(ArtKramr) wrote in news:[email protected]
m14.aol.com:

[snip]

More neocon bitterness.


Bitter and twisted is for losers.
We won the 2000 election.
We are going to win the 2004 election.
So who's bitter?

IBM

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