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-   -   Bush Flew Fighter Jets During Vietnam (http://www.aviationbanter.com/showthread.php?t=9683)

Scott Peterson July 10th 04 11:46 PM

Ed Rasimus wrote:

Ever wonder why you never met an active duty military
medical doctor in the grade of Lt?


Met lots of them......in the Navy.

Scott Peterson

--
I'm out of my mind, but please
wait for the tone and feel free
to leave a message...

145/586

Ed Rasimus July 11th 04 12:11 AM

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 15:46:36 -0700, Scott Peterson
wrote:

Ed Rasimus wrote:

Ever wonder why you never met an active duty military
medical doctor in the grade of Lt?


Met lots of them......in the Navy.

Scott Peterson


Cute. Sort of like me calling transportation and identifying myself as
"Captain" on a USN installation. I suppose clear communication might
require identifying as O-1, 2, or 3. I recall standing in line
watching Academy grads (any of the three trade schools) sorting out
their dates of rank prior to getting into a vehicle. Gotta follow that
protocol thing.


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
Smithsonian Institution Press
ISBN #1-58834-103-8

Bill Shatzer July 11th 04 12:22 AM

Ed Rasimus ) writes:

-snip-

Ah, the ol' "as far as I know" escape clause. Well, after today, you
can know--Gore served 151 days of a 360 day "combat tour". He has used
the statement that "I went because if I didn't, someone else would
have had to serve in my place." A noble sentiment, but the fact is
that someone else did have to serve to complete his curtailed tour.


Well, not by much. Gore's enlistment was up in August of
1971 and they sent him home and discharged him at the end
of May. Unless he re-enlisted, there was no way he was going
to complete a one-year tour. His "early out" cut two months,
not seven, off of his tour.

'Sides, if I recall correctly, the draw-down (and "Vietnamization")
was well underway by that time and early releases were rather
common. There's every reason to assume that no one had to
complete the remaining two months - likely his position simply
wasn't filled.

--


"Cave ab homine unius libri"

Bill Shatzer July 11th 04 12:30 AM

Ed Rasimus ) writes:

This just in. Breaking news. John Edwards didn't serve in Vietnam.
Where was he?


In high school.

--


"Cave ab homine unius libri"

OXMORON1 July 11th 04 12:30 AM

Walt asked in amazement:
ANG pilots were direct commissioned? All of them?


Those getting commissions with out prior service could get a direct commission
without a formal training program.
When the Aviation Cadet Program was still in existence, a lot of ANG pilot and
nav trainees went through the program.
All it took to get a comission in the Guard during the mid 60's was 60 college
semester hours and meeting a comissioning panel, sometimes basic training was
not even required.
Basic training became a requirement about 1967. By then most states also put
their people through some kind of OCS program.
It helped if Dad was a Senator or ANG General, but it was OK if Dad was an E-7
Technician or Mom was a secretary at Group HQ. But it was not manditory, a
sharp troop with a good record and test taking capability had a good chance.

Rick Clark

D. Strang July 11th 04 12:37 AM

"Ed Rasimus" wrote
Scott Peterson wrote:
Ed Rasimus wrote:

Ever wonder why you never met an active duty military
medical doctor in the grade of Lt?


Met lots of them......in the Navy.


Cute. Sort of like me calling transportation and identifying myself as
"Captain" on a USN installation. I suppose clear communication might
require identifying as O-1, 2, or 3. I recall standing in line
watching Academy grads (any of the three trade schools) sorting out
their dates of rank prior to getting into a vehicle. Gotta follow that
protocol thing.


I remember queuing up for a C-141 ride to Panama. This LtCol came
out and told us that the Officers would get on first so they could pick the
best seats, and the enlisted would get on second. I remember our First-Sgt
bark out "Wrong!" You almost can visualize the LtCol swaying backwards
and the Sgt said "Protocol has the lowest rank getting on first into any
vehicle." Without skipping a beat the LtCol barked out "Officers
first, enlisted second, and First-Sgt's last."



Brett July 11th 04 12:51 AM

"D. Strang" wrote:
"Ed Rasimus" wrote
Scott Peterson wrote:
Ed Rasimus wrote:

Ever wonder why you never met an active duty military
medical doctor in the grade of Lt?

Met lots of them......in the Navy.


Cute. Sort of like me calling transportation and identifying myself as
"Captain" on a USN installation. I suppose clear communication might
require identifying as O-1, 2, or 3. I recall standing in line
watching Academy grads (any of the three trade schools) sorting out
their dates of rank prior to getting into a vehicle. Gotta follow that
protocol thing.


I remember queuing up for a C-141 ride to Panama. This LtCol came
out and told us that the Officers would get on first so they could pick

the
best seats,


There are no "best seats" in a C-141 (or is/was there a VIP pallet qualified
for use on the aircraft).




D. Strang July 11th 04 12:59 AM

"Brett" wrote
"D. Strang" wrote:
"Ed Rasimus" wrote
Scott Peterson wrote:
Ed Rasimus wrote:

Ever wonder why you never met an active duty military
medical doctor in the grade of Lt?

Met lots of them......in the Navy.

Cute. Sort of like me calling transportation and identifying myself as
"Captain" on a USN installation. I suppose clear communication might
require identifying as O-1, 2, or 3. I recall standing in line
watching Academy grads (any of the three trade schools) sorting out
their dates of rank prior to getting into a vehicle. Gotta follow that
protocol thing.


I remember queuing up for a C-141 ride to Panama. This LtCol came
out and told us that the Officers would get on first so they could pick

the
best seats,


There are no "best seats" in a C-141 (or is/was there a VIP pallet qualified
for use on the aircraft).


I'm pretty much with you on that! It seemed the officers always wanted the
six seats on the last row at the back of the plane (leg room). I really didn't care
for a seat, as I would straggle back to the cargo and lay on top of a pallet for
a nap. Some loadmasters didn't like it, but most didn't give you a hard time.



Mike Marron July 11th 04 01:09 AM

Ed Rasimus wrote:

And, just now, I noticed the thread title. "Fighter Jets..."? The
airplanes are jet fighters. Or, simply just fighters. Or jets.


That was always a pet peeve of mine as well (nobody ever
says "Fighter Props.")

Another one is "motor" instead of "engine."

Ed Rasimus July 11th 04 01:28 AM

On 10 Jul 2004 23:22:54 GMT, (Bill Shatzer)
wrote:

Ed Rasimus ) writes:

-snip-

Ah, the ol' "as far as I know" escape clause. Well, after today, you
can know--Gore served 151 days of a 360 day "combat tour". He has used
the statement that "I went because if I didn't, someone else would
have had to serve in my place." A noble sentiment, but the fact is
that someone else did have to serve to complete his curtailed tour.


Well, not by much. Gore's enlistment was up in August of
1971 and they sent him home and discharged him at the end
of May. Unless he re-enlisted, there was no way he was going
to complete a one-year tour. His "early out" cut two months,
not seven, off of his tour.

'Sides, if I recall correctly, the draw-down (and "Vietnamization")
was well underway by that time and early releases were rather
common. There's every reason to assume that no one had to
complete the remaining two months - likely his position simply
wasn't filled.


Sorry, Bill, but that simply isn't so. While "early outs" were
becoming available for a few specialties as early as '71, the policy
didn't apply to overseas tours which were strictly controlled.

The only exception would be unit relocations, but not individuals.
When the 469th TFS shut down at the end of FY '72, there were no early
outs or early rotations back to CONUS. My second tour went from June
of '72 to July of '73 with no availability of curtailment.

And, you really might want to look up the duration of Mr. Gore's
overseas assignment.


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
Smithsonian Institution Press
ISBN #1-58834-103-8


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