In article ,
"Roger Long" wrote:

It's a war for civilization all right but the enemy is no more Islam than
Timothy McVeigh was a Christian patriot.

Wrong. Islam means submission and it is "the" fundamental principle in
Islam that the whole world shall submit or die. Islam is evil.
Everything the terrorists do is supported by basic, fundamental Islamic
beliefs.

This situation is only going to be
resolved when the societies that produce the terrorists change so that there
are no longer large numbers if the disaffected that see terror and
fundamentalism as the only path.

Wahabism (sp) is the catalyst and it must be destroyed.

These are Islamic societies and nothing
short of sterilizing the ground with nuclear bombs is going to change that.

No. Simply taking the oil fields and stopping the flow of money would do
it. I can think of a lot of options short of nukes.

Terrorism is as abhorrent to true Islam as it is to Christianity. Unless we
are prepared to kill millions to eliminate thousands of terrorists we will
not solve this problem until the Islamic societies become our allies in the
struggle. Your kind of thinking, and just about everything our government
is doing, works directly against this.

Again you have a basic fundamental misunderstanding of Islam. Anyone
not a muslim is an infidel, barely worthy of enslavement. I challenge
you to prove me wrong scripturally, from the words of Mohammed,
especially his later words which are more important.


The distortions of culture, society, and government in the mideast that lead
to this are largely of our (the West's) doing. The very borders of the
nations were established by Britain and other powers of the time without
regard to ethnic borders that would create stable nations. We threw the
economies and cultures completely out of whack with oil money and tolerated
and supported brutal dictatorships that would keep the oil flowing.

So what do you suggest we do about Saudi Arabia? or any of the
Emirates? Syria? Iran? This terrorism that we are facing is State
supported and financed. We must make the states that support and
finance terror decide that it isn't in their best interest to do so.
One success that we have had seem to be Libya, and Pakistan seems to be
headed in the right direction. Even Saudi Arabia seems to be rethinking
supporting Terrorists. About the only nations overtly fighting with us
is Syria, Iran and North Korea.

snip

Israel has proved that terrorism can not be eliminated by force even within
a small geographic area where some of the toughest people in the world have
enormous control and decades of understanding the situation on the ground
and the culture they are dealing with. What chance do we have over a huge
area at the end of a long logistical trail when the Pentagon can't even find
enough translators?

Curiously since Isreal has started taking out the Hamas leaders there
hasn't been a successful suicide bombing in quite a while, since
Janruary I think. If Israel took out the palistinian leadership all the
attacks would probably stop, at least until they got new leaders and
eventually new leaders might think twice about killing Jews if they knew
that they were going to die.

It may also have something to do with the fact that Saddam is no longer
giving $25,000 to the families of suicide bombers. $25,000 is a fortune
to people living in real poverty, not fake American poverty.

This is now an intractable and long term problem that is going to have to be
managed. The solution will take decades and patience. Thinking of
terrorism as something that has to be eliminated before the next election or
we'll need a new president will make true solutions impossible to pursue or
implement. Nothing constructive will happen until Islamic societies start
to function properly in the modern world, leadership in them is supported by
the population at large, and they see themselves as allies with us in the
struggle against terror. Everything being done now is probably being
cheered by Bin Laden.

Yeah, I am sure that Osama loves to scurry from cave to cave, if he is
even alive and Saddam must like prison life.

Yeah Osama must love the fact that the money supply and state support is
drying up. That is why all after all his threats and promises nothing
has happened here. Nothing speaks more eloquently about Osama's
abilities to strike at us as silence.

It's much like trying to glide to a landing spot after an engine out. Pull
back on the yoke and you will land shorter or even stall and crash. Right
now, all the passengers are screaming, "Pull up, pull up!" and big burly
fellows are struggling to the front to try and grab the yoke to pull it back
further. Kerry isn't going to do any better unless he can become the kind
of leader who can calm the passengers and regain control. I don't have a
lot of confidence that he can do that but I'd rather not have a pilot in
this situation who clearly thinks that how hard he pulls back on the yoke is
the test of his leadership.


So you want a pilot to leave the controls and go back into the passenger
compartment to soothe them and let the plane crash out of control?

Kerry wants to follow the French and let America be overrun by muslims
and take bribes from the Arabs.

LG