U=BFytkownik W.J. (Bill) Dean (U.K.). w =
wiadomo=B6ci do grup dyskusyjnych =
...
DG remove LS from the market?
Don't write such rubbish!

Been there, seen that. But... considering that the "target group" for =
similar models (e.g. more or less DG-800 and LS-10) is I'd say the same, =
in a longer period I bet the company which owns both of the brands will =
stop producing of one of these models just because maintaining the =
status quo means doubling costs in at least few points, just like the =
marketing two brands / models at one time targeted for the same =
customer. This could mean that the same area is "covered" by double =
expenses and still without fighting competitors on the market.

Keeping two brands would have sense if they would be targeted on =
different customers. E.g. LS would be marketed as "high-end" gliders, =
and the DG as the "value for money" brand just like I'd position the LAK =
or HPH produced Glasfluegel 304CZ. Then one brand would supplement the =
market area not covered by the second. If they have kept LS and DG in =
the same form together, they would just show canibalism only.

NOTE WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT BRAND PHILOSOPHY.

When cost cutting will is implemented, then wallet talks, not =
philosophy.

Note that only 12 LS 4s have been made in the last two years.

Which still is a very succesful design, and a talented businessman would =
find some $$$ in the molds.
Just take the Discus CS, doesn't it resemble such a scheme?

Note that DG are keeping the separate dealerships for LS;

That makes sense, just look at the FIAT dealerships (at least in here in =
Poland). In most cases there are separate dealers for FIAT, Lancia and =
Alfa Romeo. Selling LS and DG under one roof means selling two competing =
(at least theoretically) brands. Customer could be distracted. See the =
beginning of the post.

"Isn't it a shame - a black day for German gliding":

Moving LS-4 production to LAK is not a shame, it's just an example of =
effective cost management.
The next step would be looking for local materials if regulations and =
their quality allow (the most probably the second part would be answered =
yes).

What chance is there that LAK could get the LS 8 back into production =
as
quickly as DG, and to the same quality?
Much the same question applies to the future of the LS10.

I am not sure if I understood properly Your expression, but I think it =
is possible without any problem.
You may be surprised when Lithuania, on the 1st May 2004 enters the EU.
=20
Will LAK be able to give the same service in the long term to existing
owners as DG?

My answer is yes. It's not nationality, but people disregarding the =
passport they bear who ensure that.

=20
In my experience in the UK East European gliders are bought because:
They are much cheaper,

I agree. There are also "smart buyers" who look for the "value for =
money".

They are readily available when there is a long waiting list for the =
German
equivalent,

Not always. I think that the Germans did a good job (for them) by =
selling a certain amount of gliders slowly, but for the long time. Not =
just like the SZD which produced e.g. Fokas and Cobras in large numbers =
in short time.

They have some capability not available in a German glider, e.g. the
aerobatic Swift.

I agree.

They have never been able to compete head-to-head.

Sorry, but than is not worth remarking. Just see at '60s and '70s =
contests and then type such a rubbish.
Stick out the nose outside the Isle of Fog and see that there exists a =
world outside the United Kingdom and former colonies.
=20
There is a long history of German manufacturers sub-contracting to =
East
Europe and elsewhere, and a long history of resulting problems and =
inferior
quality (though not invariably).

Have You ever been to Poland? If yes, how many years ago?
Things have changed a bit, stereotypes change slower. Unfortunately.
Just think about it when You'll ask Your bank by the phone to make a =
money transfer. You've got a huge amount of probability that the nice =
woman at the second end of the telephone line sits somewhere in South =
Africa, India or Poland for example (the last case especially if the =
bank customer is German speaking).

Do you remember that Schempp sub-contracted the Open Cirrus to =
Yugoslavia?
The German built ones have always commanded a premium over the Yugo =
built
ones.

During old bad communism time... We know that. I personally remember =
these times. That's why I see things changed drastically over the last =
ten years.

Some sub-contracted gliders have matched the quality of the German =
gliders,
and the German manufacturers have sub-contracted on that assumption.
However, on the second hand market there is often a preference for the
German built product.

Stereotypes again... (at least if we talk about today's products). Just =
look how many parts in Your car are made in Poland and Czech Republic. I =
warn You: it may be scary experience! Driving such a Eastern Block =
crap... Look at the airbag and the safety belts - weren't they =
manufactured by TRW or Autoliv? If yes, there's a chance my friend's mom =
has produced it! Aren't You afraid of that in case of an accident?


I think that what seems to be happening to DG and LS is very bad news =
for
gliding generally.

Still don't agree, but... everyone has right to have his own opinion...

Regards,


--=20
Janusz Kesik

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