Bert Willing wrote:

Non-catastrophic may happen if you have a structure which has a plastic
behavious prior to rupture.
Ironically, you don't have that with "plastic" gliders. You might well
enconter that you can pull more g's because the designer has put lots of
margins, and nothing will happen
But if *something* happens, you're wings are simply gone on a GRP/CRP ship.
The idea that you'll get away with some sort of damage and land the ship is,
hm, fairly naive.

But to the initial question: If you are going to exceed Vne in a dive, you
can chose between putting your joker on a good spacing between Vne and
flutter speed, or put your joker on a pessimistic design margin and a well
crafted serial number. There is actually no way to tell the answer
beforehand.

I agree with Bert. To imagine Don's advice to be suitable for all
gliders is too ignore the huge differences in design and materials. For
example, the flexible, fiberglass wing of ASW 20 probably means it has a
greater strength reserve because of the extra material needed to control
flutter, while the stiffer carbon wing in the ASW 27 might give it the
reverse margins. Consider the Standard Cirrus with it's relatively thick
fiberglass wing: where are it's margins the greatest? And, it appears
the 25 m gliders may have special problems.

Until you have discussed the design of your _particular_ glider with
it's designer, you are simply speculating about the dangers of
overspeeding versus overloading. Even the designer may not know, if the
glider hasn't been tested to flutter! And if you damage the structure
during a high G pull-up, what do you suppose will happen to the speed at
which flutter occurs? You may now have damaged glider experiencing flutter!

Fortunately, this situation seems to rare. Personally, I have never
encountered it in 4500 hours of soaring, not even an incipient spin.
Here is more speculation: I think the reality is most pilots that have
the problem will use Don's method out of reflex, not training or
conscious choice.

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Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA