"Ron Rosenfeld" wrote in message
...

That doesn't make sense to me. If the ODP is being protected, then a
conflict will not arise. If a "head to head situation" arises, then the
ODP was not being protected.

Inside Class D, below MVA, for a visual approach in vmc? Aren't both
aircraft VFR for the purposes of collision avoidance at this point? What
protection would be provided? Radar services are not being provided to
either aircraft along the ODP since both are inside the ring and below MVA.
Now if it were IMC, that would be a different case, but there are no
approaches that traverse this ODP, so there would be no truly VFR aircraft
or IFR aircraft on visual approaches in that space; it's pretty easy to
protect.


Also, you previously wrote that "both held that an ODP needs to be
requested by the pilot if not issued"

That is just not the case. An ODP never needs to be requested by the
pilot. The pilot may fly it at his prerogative, unless alternate
departure
instructions have been received from ATC.

True. I think I overstated that. The idea was that they would hope that I
would tell them of my intentions to fly the ODP to make things go more
smoothly for all involved. I took this to mean that I really should have
requested it, even though it's not required.



Approach control should NOT give you vectors below the MVA/MIA (with rare
exceptions as noted above).

However, if you say "...can we get on course?", ATC could certainly say
"Proceed on course". They have not given you a vector, and you are still
responsible for terrain clearance.

If you say to ATC, "We'd like to ..." ATC will generally assume that you
feel it is safe and legal for you to do so and that you are able to do so.
Whether they allow it or not usually depends on factors other than
terrain.
Some of these factors include traffic and LOA's between facilities that
may
require you to be in a certain spot.

Absolutely, and until ATC and you concur on that course of action, I think
proceeding according to the ODP is the ideal strategy to reach the enroute
system.