Morgans wrote:
"Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATsuddenlink.net wrote

I'm not talking about getting sneaked up on. I'm talking about ROE
that have not a thing to do with the capibility of the aircraft.

Even close in, they have short range missles to do the job.

I'm not advocating not having guns. I just don't think they have much
relevance, in all but the most unusual conditions. I sure could not
justify taking away from an aircraft's ability to stand off and
fight, to have that kind of radical maneuverability.

Just out of curiosity, when was the last time that the US took down
an enemy plane with gunfire alone?

I can't think of anyplace to find that out but in trying so I came accross
this.

http://www.aviationweek.com/avnow/ne...aw010807p1.xml

As the F-22 begins its operational life, interest has turned to assessing
just how well suited the stealthy Raptor is to its role as the premier
air-to-air fighter, while taking a peek at some of the surprises for pilots
and maintenance crews as they explore what the aircraft can do. As part of
the research for this series of articles on the F-22, Michael Fabey flew in
the back seat of an F-15D while the Eagle and Raptor pilots demonstrated
their aircraft's capabilities in the air-to-air ranges at Tyndall AFB, Fla.
(For additional details of the Raptor's unique air-to-air capabilities, see
AW&ST Sept. 6, 1999, p. 84.)

The F-22 is proving it's a dogfighter after all.

While it wasn't part of a hard-turning furball, an F-22--with its Amraams
and Sidewinders expended--slipped into visual range behind an F-16 and
undetected made a simulated kill with its cannon during the stealth
fighter's first large-scale exercise and deployment outside the continental
U.S.