You may be pilot in command many times when you cannot log
that time. There are two kinds of pilot in command.

There is pilot experience pilot in command and there is who
the hell goes to jail pilot in command. One is pilot
experience and one is legal responsibility. They may be
the same person and they may be two or more different
people.

FAR 91.109 allows the safety pilot, as a required crew
member to log the time in accordance with 61.51, but 61.51
STILL requires that actual sole manipulations of the
controls is required to log any PIC time that will apply to
a rating, currency or other purpose.

Just because two pilots agree who will be RESPONSIBLE for
the flight, they cannot alter FAR 61.51 as to who can log
pilot experience PIC time.

If the FAA finds that you have logged time improperly, they
may disallow any or all the time in question. If ratings
have been issued, they can be revoked. If fraud is present
[not merely an innocent error] and flight operations have
been conducted, serious legal action may be taken by the
FAA.


"Mark Hansen" wrote in message
...
| On 01/22/07 14:03, Mark Hansen wrote:
| On 01/22/07 13:01, Jim Macklin wrote:
| You cite the rule, that by the two exceptions the FAA
lists
| for logging time as PIC when not manipulating the
controls,
| allow logging that time as PIC just because two bozos
agree
| to both log PIC time beforehand.
|
| We're weren't talking about bozos. We were talking about
Pilots.
|
|
| It is legal to log the time under the requirement of
91.109
| but 91`.109 does not state whether that loggable time
is PIC
| or SIC.
|
| That's right - it doesn't. However, 61.51 says that it
can be
| logged as PIC (under the conditions mentioned earlier).
|
|
| Once again, you've simply copied the existing FARs
without noting
| the specific FAR which supports your point.
|
| Are you able to cite the specific FAR are aren't you?
|
| As I've said before, 61.51 (e) (1) (iii) says that the
pilot not
| flying can log PIC during the time the pilot flying is
under the
| hood so long as both pilots agree that the pilot flying
is acting
| ^^^^^^^^^^^^
|
| Oops, this should have been pilot not flying, of course.
|
| as PIC and the pilot not flying meets the other
requirements (certs,
| ratings, etc.)
|
|