"Charles Talleyrand" wrote in message
...

"Dudley Henriques" wrote in message
. net...
What Guy said is considered in the fighter community to be the right
answer.
The reality of this oft asked question is that no single aircraft can be
found supreme throughout it's performance envelope when compared
directly to
the entire performance envelope of another aircraft. This has been
proven
out again and again in our modern comparison performance or delta Ps
performance testing. The answer is ALWAYS where in the envelope and/or
mission parameters is the comparison taking place?

This is true, but perhaps besides the point.

Suppose you're an air minister. The Fokker Eindekker has just come out.
Do you want some? YES

Suppose you're a pilot. You can fly either a Fokker Eindekker or it's
competitor. Which would you pick?

Can you think of some equally dominating airplane?

Hi Charles;
First off, Please know that I'm not trying to rain on your parade here; just
trying to be helpful!!
:-))
You can indeed ask your initial question exactly as you did. It's fine! I'm
only offering you some additional insight, just in case you ever get into
this issue with anyone from the flight test community as you are now with
me. The subject invariably digresses into a 1v1 scenario, which, from your
post above, is about where you are going with this now. It's no biggie
really, but consider the following;
In placing the Eindekker in competition with an unknown adversary as you
have here by the general context of your questions to me, you are getting
away from your initial context, which is again fine, but in these
discussions, you must always be aware that in the context you have placed
the issue, only a general answer that deals directly with design can exist
in reality. Individual aircraft can be discussed for their design advances,
and even in a design context per time period, but you can't start pairing
individual airplanes against each other unless you are also in consideration
of the parameters I have mentioned. Take your Eindekker for example, and the
questions you have asked me in this post.
Eindekker or no Eindekker, the result of the scenario you have described
would be ENTIRELY dependent on the factors I have already mentioned. If you
placed two comparison aircraft
on the ground together, you could easily state the design advantages of the
Eindekker for it's period and be totally correct. But put the Eindekker in
the hands of a novice pilot against a highly skilled adversary in an
aircraft without the design advantages of the Eindekker, and the design
advantages could easily be nullified....and even in a specific scenario,
where the Eindekker pilot hasn't the experience in type to take full
advantage of the aircraft's design advantage......easily reversed into a
negative for the Eindekker. The important point in all this is that in
fighter comparison, the data isn't really explored in the format you're
using.
I'm not trying to give you a hard time here, and you most certainly can make
a case for a particular aircraft as a stand out in it's time. The Eindekker
is a good example of that. I'm only telling you that we in the community
take the format you are trying to nail down as moot when it comes to a
discussion of fighters in the real world.
I'm also aware that what I'm
telling you isn't necessarily tied to the format you're discussing here. I'm
only passing it on to you as general information that you might want to
consider when discussing fighter comparison in ANY format . I know you guys
like to be as
accurate as possible when you get into these things, and the information I'm
giving you is simply some of the factors we consider when making up
comparison analysis format for 1v1. I hope it's helpful to you.
What you have said about the Eindekker, and what Stephen has said about the
262 and the Zeke are pertinent , and perhaps even more pertinent then
what I'm telling you for the format you're discussing.......as long as you
don't come down to a 1v1 scenario :-))))
Bottom line on this issue as it would be seen in the flight test community
is this. As long as you are just considering design advances per se, you can
safely discuss an individual airplane as a standout for it's time; but as
soon as you take that design advantage and put it into the sky with another
airplane, the whole ball game changes to exactly what I have explained about
delta comparison fighter analysis.
All the best,
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI
Retired

Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI
Retired