"Matt Whiting" wrote

Blaming the schools alone isn't legitimate, but they certainly have been a
significant contributor. Public schools long ago moved from a "personal
responsibility" to a "self-esteem" based approached that has been
disastrous and is a significant contributor to many of society's problems
today.

No longer can schools punish students as it is either illegal or will harm
the students' self-esteem.

I'm not sure if what you are saying is a deliberate concept of education, or
has become a part of education just has it become a way of our society.
Education does usually directly reflect our society's values and approaches
towards responsibility. I can't disagree with a lot of what you are
saying, just refute that it is being caused by education. It is a question
of cause or effect. School causing the problem, or schools exhibiting the
problem because of society? That is the question.

How I wish we could punish students appropriately. We are powerless, as
most avenues of punishment have been taken from us. In large part, much of
what IS wrong with schools have been imposed on them by -------. You fill
in the blank.

When a student fails a class, we blame everyone but the student and find a
way to move them along anyway.

Oh, we as teachers would love to keep them behind when they fail. They need
to be kept behind until they get it right, or reach a certain level of
competency, but someone else that "knows better" won't let that happen.

Speaking of such things, why are we letting kids that can't read, take other
classes that require reading? (like all of them) They should be kept in
concentrated reading until they can.

It is like keeping a student that can not land an airplane working on
circles around a point, or other maneuvers, then when they can do them,
signing them off to solo. They are not ready to solo, if they can't land,
right? COMMON SENSE ! It happens in education, though. They take science
classes that require math, when they can't add or multiply. They take
sociology, or history, when they can't read.

How about speaking English? We continue teaching (in English) and when they
go to do a worksheet or homework on what was talked about in class, we send
them to ESL English as a Second Language) tutors to help them with the work.
How can they know what the work is about, if they could not understand what
the teacher was saying?

This type of thing is what I find so frustrating about teaching. Teachers
usually know what is needed, but they can't make it happen. Students should
not be allowed to continue until they meet certain levels of competency.
You are right, that they are pushed along, but that is not teachers making
that happen.

I'm totally frustrated with many things in education, the way it is today.
I try to do the best , thing for the student, and try to overcome the
obsticals, and it is totally frustrating, some days. I would not reccomend
anyone to go into education, today. Teachers have their hands tied in too
many ways, and are treated with a lack of respect by some students, almost
daily. I wonder if it could be worth it, for anyone.

I know you have public school connections (your wife as I recall), but the
reality is that public schools HAVE contributed to this phenomenon of
sending subtle, and sometimes not so subtle, messages that nothing is YOUR
fault it is the fault of the "system", and don't worry as the "system"
will take care of you anyway.

I don't see that as a message that is a direct result of education, but as a
result of how education has had their hands tied. The "system will take
care of you" is a direct observation of how society treats problems, and
people with problems, nowdays.

Also, I wanted to comment on "No Child Left Behind, and how that has been
such a total failure, and perhaps one of the very worst pieces of
legislation to ever hit the public schools.

All kids are not created equal, and can not possibly be treated the same, to
achieve to their maximum potential. It can't work. It doesn't work.

If the guberment would keep their hands off of educators, and let them do
what is needed (instead of passing more legislation mandating this and that)
perhaps you would see education improve. As it is, we are so busy trying to
meet one requirement or the other, that there is little time to teach.

Well, enough. I get tired of beating my head against the wall, talking
about this. I'll try real hard to be quiet, now! g
--
Jim in NC