On Mon, 3 Nov 2003 00:53:38 +0100, "Emmanuel Gustin" wrote:

"Chris Mark" wrote in message
...

In contrast to
your assertion that "the real reasons for the increasing tension between
Europe
and America are the different cultural values...." they and others,
including
the Italian poet and novelist Roberto Pazzi ("Conclave"), emphasized that
our
values are the same.
I'll take their word for it--not yours.

The two statements are not contradictory: "Values" is a plural
concept. It is true that Americans and Europeans share a lot of
values; it is also true that on a number of important points, our
values are different. Shared values have the potential of holding
the transatlantic alliance together; differences in opinion, especially
when voiced with the grating repetition that is so characteristic
of US politics, are driving it apart.

I certainly hope so. An alliance with Europe costs the US in
both treasure and lives. We should let Europe collapse on
its own.

There is nothing wrong with having different values and opinions,
as long as you are capable of respecting each other and having
a healthy debate. If that fails, then friendship, alliance, and
ultimately democracy itself will break down, even down to the
point of Civil War. In a sense it is less the difference of opinions
between Europeans and Americans that is driving them apart,
than the contempt publicly shown by people who ought to know
better --- for example Rumsfeld's jibe about 'Old Europe'.

Democracy has broken down in Europe. It is doing just fine
in the US. "Old europe" is the correct term for criminals like
Chirac.

And I am frankly sick and tired of the intellectual laziness and
dishonesty of a certain kind of Americans, who dismiss any
foreign critique of current US policy (and that is policy, not
even culture or values) as anti-Americanism. (Just like they
dismiss similar criticism, when it comes from their own
countrymen, as un-American.)

Europe is clearly anti-American, but they try to hide it
because we feed them, guard them from their enemies, etc.

As if the fact that someone doesn't like the ideas of George W. Bush
and his cronies also implies a dislike of all Americans, including
John Doe, who lives in Maine and didn't even vote for him...

If you hate the US so much you can go to He** for all we care.

Al MInyard