On Oct 28, 8:47 am, Andy wrote:
On Oct 28, 7:32 am, Andreas Maurer wrote:
On Thu, 28 Oct 2010 06:53:27 -0700 (PDT), Brian
wrote:
I hadn't really considered how the projected flight path system works
before. But after thinking about it for a bit it has a lot of
potentional. How much the Flarm actually uses I do not know.
Flarm uses ONLY projected flight paths to calculate a collision
probability.
Even without that I
can see that gliders could get very close but have potential flight
paths that would make colliding impossible and as a result would not
create a collision alarm.
This is exactly how Flarm works.
Flarm doesn't care about distances - as long as Flarm doesn't detect a
potential collision cource, you can fly very close to each other
without getting a warning - even if you are circling.
Andreas
I think that's the secret for how you make it useful in thermals - if
the system knows you are circling it can do a better job predicting
your curved flight path and potential threats along that path. I
presume that if you assume the full maneuvering envelope of each
glider you'd generate a lot of warnings, so it would make sense to
assume something more limited that strikes a balance between false
positive warnings and missing potential maneuvers that could create a
threat with little advanced notice. Think of a glider pulling up into
a thermal as a good example. I assume that Flarm does all this based
on the following explanation where an expanding projected flight path
envelope is depicted:
http://www.gliderpilot.org/Flarm-WhatDoesItDo
As to ADS-B - without some algorithm for projecting flight paths the
only warning you can realistically generate is a proximity warning.
Even warning only for declining separation distance is a crude form of
relative path prediction, just not a very useful one - particularly
for glider operations with multiple targets and circling flight.
9B
Just to give a flavor ADS-B data-out systems as mandated for 2020 in
the USA for power aircraft (basically where a transponder is required
today) will put out the following data
Aircraft ICAO ID (can be made anonymous for a UAT on VFR flight)
Aircraft callsign/flight number (not required for VFR flight)
Time of applicability
GPS Lattitude
GPS Longitude
GPS altitude
Airborne/on-surface status
Northbound ground velocity component while airborne (from GPS)
Eastbound ground velocity component while airborne (from GPS)
Heading while on the surface
Ground speed while on the surface
Pressure altitude
Vertical rate (may be pressure or GPS based)
GPS uncertainty/integrity (which needs information form a fancy TSO-
C145 class WAAS GPS)
Ident (equivalent to transponder ident/SPI)
Distress/Emergency status
ADS-B data-in/display capability
TCAS equipage/status
This is a simplified list and there is various other status/validity
data as well. There is also the concept in ADS-B messages of an
estimated position, and even estimated velocity. But AFAIK this is not
intended for fancy manoeuvrings predictions - it is more intended to
allow different parts of the ADS-B infrastructure to project position
or velocity updated to a single time of applicability. There is space
for future expansion and as an example there is long-term work
underway to look at an ADS-B based replacement for TCAS that could
well utilize extra data transmission than that above, but think well
post 2020 for this to actually happen. My brain hurts enough thinking
about ADS-B as is.
---
BTW my suspicion is given that the FAA currently requires a STC for
any installation for ADS-B data out that it is currently not possible
to install any ADS-B data-out system in the USA in any certified
aircraft (including gliders) that only meets a subset of the 2020
mandate requirements (ie. does not include all the stuff above). Which
I expect the FAA would also require fully TSO-C154c/DO-282B (UAT) TSO-
C166b/DO-260B (1090ES) and with the corresponding TSO-C145 level GPS.
Experimental aircraft are another question since an STC cannot apply
to them. This STC restriction hopefully is short-term as its is going
to have a chilling effect on ADS-B data-out adoption in general
aviation and gliders. Besides some more complex issues you can start
to see even simple installation concerns that are probably causing
this current STC requirement, such as squat switch/or other on-ground
detection, needs to have a single squawk code and ident button across
any installed transponder(s) and ADS-B data-out devices, ability to
transmit a distress/emergency code, ability to turn off the ADS-B
transmissions if requested, etc.
Darryl