"Jackie Mulheron" wrote in message
...
"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...
In message , Jackie Mulheron
writes
In article , "Paul J. Adam"
writes:
Sure, but it means you get to pay for them (and most of the support
and
TacDev is way down south,

Och I'm sure it won't be as bad as the constant Defence Reviews and
reorganisations we have in the UK at the behest of the Treasury.

It'll be worse for both sides.

Well Phil Hunt seems to think otherwise and is posting some good detailed
stuff. You don't think the MOD is a model of efficiency do you?

I heard a tale (was a guy in the RAF as well) who said that the fly past
of
Tornados at the Jubilee was backed up with another equal number so
unconfident were they of their ability to stay airworthy.

Inspirational stuff along with a Tescos style supply system. Or is it
Morrisons?

meaning you need to pay again to duplicate it
if it's a hostile split). Balkanisation isn't usually a good idea (I
mean, _look_ at the Balkans - would _you_ want to live there?)

This isn't the Balkans. More sedate like the "splits" with Canada et
al.

'Sedate'? The poster who got me into this argument was claiming that
Scotland would get what it wanted or start throwing Tridents around.

Well he isn't called "Auld" Bob because he's a sprightly adolescent. He's
pulling your chain (I hope he's pulling your chain!!!) and I doubt he will
be leading the movement for national liberation anyway.

A peaceful, negotiated separation would mean significant loss of
capability on both sides, but could be managed to minimise the pain. But
the scenario presented was simple thuggery.

It could also mean they just keep the institutions and have them as a
shared
resource with some designated units and bases under some form of sovereign
control. Sure it could be worked out. Probably please the Marshalls and
Admirals as well as the two governments avoid annoying each other with
calling for those incessant reviews.

The idea of a British Isles Balkans is just the fantasy hyperbole
passing
for
unionist political propaganda.

Why? Two elements of a 'former nation-state', one breaking away with
significant expertise and strong will, another determined to crush this
'minority revolt' having most of the big guns (and please, consider
something called the Permissive Action Link)

And unlikely to happen. Ghandi admitted that it was because the British
were
essentially decent that they accepted the inevitability of Indian
independence.

Most of the countries becoming independent from London government did so
peacefully and with agreement. But their not as "interesting" to read
about
as the the others. And in most of those other cases the violence was
usually
an internal one which the British found themselves having to get through.

It's a situation to be devoutly avoided. If Scotland really wants to
break free, then I have strong reasons for both sides to sort the issue
out peacefully.

And there's no reason to believe it won't be.

But it was not I that advanced the notion of "if we don't get what we
want, we just nuke London".

Again that's just Bob. It would be a bit difficult getting to that point
in
the first place what with having to storm Faslane, make sure the subs
don't
slip out and have the people to operate them or know the codes to fire
them.
(Why am I even considering such a ridiculous scenario???!!!)

Most countries go their separate ways quite
amicably. It's just that their stories don't make good movies.

Quite so. And as the son of a mother from Aberdeen and a father from
Perth, I'd devoutly hope that the separation would be as painless and
efficient as possible.

Just look up the Commonwealth countries in their site and the names of
most
won't spring out as ones who had a "War" of independence. Where there was
conflict it was invariably cock up by the British in handling an angsty or
belligerent minority - Orangemen/Republicans in Ireland, Communist Chinese
in Malaysia, Hindus/Muslims in India, Mau Mau in Kenya or white
settlers/black nationalists in Rhodesia.

But that doesn't change the fact that some hard choices would have to be
made and the negotiations would get downright "frank and forthright" at
times..

Oh they'll probably be a few cards kept close to the chest but which
Scotland is willing to throw away. Could end up with keeping the present
organisation on a shared basis, or have leased or sovereign bases a la
Cyprus, maybe do away with it all and let London do it a la Iceland. Nukes
may be the sticking point but not that Scotland wants to keep them.

Careful there - the US might remember the Auld Alliance and decide
that
Scotland is close enough to France to become part of the Axis of Evil.
Trying to auction nuclear warheads might get some unwelcome
gatecrashers
(besides, most of the customers are short on manners, and might decide
that it was easier to kill other bidders than match their price, then
the auctioneer gets hit in the crossfire, and where's your profit
then?)

Be a tad dangerous hitting us in the crossfire when we still have the
capability of delivering the goods for free.

Deliver them to whom? Scotland doesn't have a DSP network or any BMEWS
stations. You know for sure you just got hit, you have the mushroom
clouds to prove it, but whose hand did the deed and where should you
retaliate?

How could they do that when we haven't sold the good to "them" yet?

For that matter, according to some you've just auctioned off some
nuclear weapons to the highest bidder: how can you be sure they didn't
just use you as a live-fire test of their new toys (and to avoid having
the cheque cashed?)

We'd cash it first and do an Israel Dirty Harry style - "Did we only have
five to sell you or was there a sixth?"

By the way I was being facetious with the last comment.


Frae Auld Bob Peffers:
Just for the record what was said by me was quite plain. It was due to
someone's assumptions that the armed forces belonged to England. My reply
was that if this was true then Scotland would just
hang on to what was already in Scotland - Virtually the entire nuclear
fleet. The guy went of on a great tirade with way to much detail and some
garbled bluster about what England would do. My reply was, a bit tongue in
cheek, that Scotland would just auction off the nukes to the highest bidder.

The essential point was, though, that Scotland, as a partner in the UK
already owned and thus were due a fair share of the existing forces.

Not my fault the silly bugger could not see the wood for the trees. Far as I
go if Scotland does ever gain independence our best friends will still be
our best friends and these are England, Wales and Ireland. Furthermore
Scotland has shown no desire to gain independence in any way other than the
ballot box, (but what else can you expect out of a military genius with too
many weapons on his fevered mind).
--

Aefauldlie, (Scots word for Honestly),
Robert, (Auld Bob), Peffers,
Kelty,
Fife,
Scotland, (UK).
Web Site, "The Eck's Files":- http://www.peffers50.freeserve.co.uk
E-Mail:-
(Tak oot the wee dug tae send e-mail).


---
Aa ootgannin screivings maun hae nae wee beasties wi thaim..
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