Thread: Bad timing...
View Single Post
  #34  
Old March 13th 07, 03:46 AM posted to rec.aviation.piloting,rec.aviation.owning
Peter Dohm
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,754
Default Bad timing...

Eight pounds is quite a weight saving, especially since Pipers have very
positive nose wheel steering, so the toe brakes provide only redundancy.

My
personal prejudice favors the greatest theoretical redundancy, meaning

nose
wheel steering plus toe brakes


Yes, but then you also might argue that toe brakes (requiring two
cylinders, two pressurized lines, etc) have twice as many failure
points for the same mission-critical system (Braking)... so while you
get redundant steering, you get it at the cost of more mission
critical parts to fail

I'm stirring the pot of course, I would gladly step up to a newer
aircraft with toe brakes if given the opportunity, I'm just saying I
don't miss them on my current bird

For me the 2k labor + 8lbs was the primary deciding factor (funny how
that works)

This is a common topic of hangar flying sessions, and I am not really a
strong advocate either way. I only have a preference, if faced with two
otherwise equal airplanes at essentially the same price.

BTW, the Gruman Cheetah and Tiger models, and many of the newer training
aircraft, have castoring nosewheels--so steering is accomplished by
differential braking until the rudder becomes effective.


I've flown a friends cheetah... Going from my direct-drive, simple
rudder pedal steering too a toe-brake-only system was... interesting,
to say the least.

I can't argue with you there, although the only plane with toe-brake only
steering that I ever had occasion to taxi was an an Aero Commender.
Interestingly, the rudder was reasonably effective at a much lower speed
than I would have supposed. (I no longer recall the speed--or the wind
conditions)

Actually, the size of the rudder and its relationship to the vertical
stabilizer plays a major role in the need for toe brakes, nosewheel
steering, or even tailwheel steering. I have read that the Supermarine
Spitfire had no tail wheel lock and also no tailwheel steering--and I am
confident that some here will correct me if I am mistaken.

My biggest issue in that plane however was it was simply too small for
me... I could not get into a position where I could manipulate the
pedals comfortably... (same with most toe-brake equipped planes (I'm
6'4, 240), but the grumman was particularly bad)

Shame, because otherwise I love the grummans... great view and fun to
fly.

I've never gotten to try one on, but should find it a little easier. I'm a
little guy by comparison--6'1", 200#--and intending to lose 20#.

That should cause them to have faster right side brake wear than Cessna

trainers, which
have spring steering which allows the nose wheel to lock straight ahead

in flight.

I think the issue Any training airplane has is simply... trainees...
even aircraft Pipers and Cessnas... it takes a few flights to get in
the hang of keeping your foot off the brakes and on the rudder at
takeoff... for some (like me) its rather uncomfortable even

No argument there. In my case, it was simply a matter of putting my feet as
low a practical on the pedals. However, in the case of something like the
Gruman it would be a little more complicated, a lot would depend on whether
there was sufficient rudder authority just from the prop blast--if not, it
should be a matter of keeping my toes off of the left brake on the take off
roll.

and which can become a little problematic; especially if the nose strut

and
the springs are not maintained.


I read somewhere that Cessna Milked that patent for all it was worth
and despite the MX issues, I think its a smarter system... I still
live in fear (especially when fighting particularly gusty x-winds) of
touching down sooner than I anticipate with a nice heavily cocked
front nose wheel and hearing the control line go *SNAP*...

I flew Tomahawks in crosswinds while I was still plenty ham fisted (or is
that ham footed) and that was never a problem. The airplane's response was
so non-memorable that I have no recollection of it.

I suppose I should add that I was taught to hold the nose off untill a good
bit of speed was lost, rather than actively derotating. Actually, in the
worst case, I doubt that a nosewheel still cocked would do more than make me
appear clumsy--unless it was combined with a worse error.

Peter