Subject: Too Long Donald Trump tells Bush. "You're fired"
From: (OXMORON1)
Date: 7/15/2004 9:23 AM Pacific Standard Time
Message-id:

Art wrote:
Political talk is ok as long as it is balanced by military aviation
matrerial.
What is annoying is when some only post political stuff never anything to do
with military aviation. Maybe that is because they have no contributions to
make and no experience in military aviation. Your objections seem to revolve
around only tjhose who disagree with you. There is more than one political
viewpoint in his country. Have you noticed? Ed has been posting a lot of
political stuiff. I noticed you have never posted any objections to his
material. Wonder why? BTW. do you have anything to post military
aviation?

Political talk, when it is repetitive, inane BS (not necessarily your
comments)
wastes time and detracts from the basic slant of this newsgroup.
Political viewpoints are different and yes there are more than one. Each has
it's place.
Ed's (BUFFDRvr,etal) stuff does include some of his political views, but he
can
usually back up his position with fact or a quotable source. I don't
necessarily agree with everything Ed says but he doesn't over shadow his
comments with repetitive non verfiable opinion presented as fact (again not
necessarily your posts). I do send comments to Ed if we are in total
disagreement.
I do post to this group when I have facts that are relevant (well, most of
the
time) to avaition, specifcally low level recce, overwater naviagtion and
celestial naviagtion, B-57, C-97 and C-124 aircraft. If you will remember it
was me who described the periscopic sextant to you several years ago.
I defer to you regarding bombing the bridges in Europe and bomb/nav
proceedures
during WWII. I will question you concerning what I perceive as erronious
information concerning the things I know about.
I will defer to you concerning flak over Europe and the "Hun in the Sun"
I will question you about 2000 mile naviagtion legs when nothing on the
freaking airplane works. But usually I will agree with you in this area.
I will defer to you regarding the ballistic charistics of WWII era bombs. I
will question you regarding the capabilities of the aerial cameras in use
during the 60's and early 70's.
I will agree with you concerning the driftmeter and "Double Drift"
capabilities.
I will defer to you regarding shooting skeet at the Nelles Gun Club. I will
question you regarding "Fireballing Wake Island".
I will question you conerning blowing half the jug stackbolts while reversing
props in the tropics because you have never experienced it.
I will question you concerning "GRID' navigation because I know you never
used
it.
I will also comment on the RF-4, C-47, C-54, B-47, T-29, and EA-3 Skywarrior
because I know a little bit about them and have time in them.
I will question the dumb butts who question Bush being AWOL from the Denver
Reserve Center because they don't know (or won't admit) that it was a record
center not an active training/ops facility for regularly scheduled
Reserve/ANG
functions.
I will question the motives of Bush, etal for Iraq, but not necessarily in
this
venue. Most of it has nothing to do with with aviation, except that it
probably
will affect our national security for years to come.
I will question Kerry's motives and record in Vietnam and since, but again
not
here. It doesn't have squat to do with aviation except possibly with military
budgets and strength.
I will admire the grioundcrews here and overseas during all the wars. I will
admire the poor trash hauler who spent 10,000 hours droning around the world
because someone has to do it.
I will admire my father who spent 28 years in the Air National Guard and
Active
Duty in three wars and countless callups. Who also never got out of the
States
during WWII because his Squadron/Group/Wing Commander wouldn't release him.
I will admire my brother, the LTC retired, who jumped out of perfectly good
airplanes, flew dinky helicopters and risked his butt to retrieve people from
landing zones in a war that I should have questioned 35 years ago.
I will admire the ANG crews who spent over 50% of their time on Active Duty
last year.
I will question the Major Harry Schmidts who screw up and kill people and
won't
admit it. I will question his superiors who should have trained and
supervised
him more properly. I think he would have screwed up whether he was Regular or
ANG.

Your turn.

Rick Clark
MFE



You leave me speechless. And that ain't easy to do.



Arthur Kramer
344th BG 494th BS
England, France, Belgium, Holland, Germany
Visit my WW II B-26 website at:
http://www.coastcomp.com/artkramer