"No Badge For Frank" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 18:17:36 GMT, "Eric Scheie"
wrote:

Landing defeats the entire purpose of the air crew. carrying a gun is
not the issue. Understanding police tactics & proceedure is the issue.


Yes, I agree, the issue is understanding tactics and procedure. I still
maintain that it you will probably get a better product, and a safer program
by taking an experienced pilot and giving them training in police tactics
and procedure.


Put yourself in an observer's shoes,
would you rather fly with pilot with maybe 250-300 hours who just got
their
commerical rating, or a pilot with 2000 hours? Ask the taxpayers who they
want flying their aircraft.


How many hours do you think our military pilots have when we turn them
loose in an F-18? A few hundred. It all comes down to the quality of
the training.


the F/A-18 pilot - not even a valid argument. There is a popular
misconception that a new pilot in the single seat version is trained and
then "let loose all by themselves". Granted, they are the only one sitting
in the Hornet, however, they are FAR from alone. While they may do certain
training or cross country flights by themselves, they do not go into combat
alone. A new pilot will fly along with another, more experienced pilot.

quality of training. This is something that is evaluated throughout a
pilot's training (Hornet, or otherwise) in the military. A new F/A-18 driver
has gone through 2 years or more of flight training before they get to their
first operational squadron. That pilot also learns the basics of tactics and
procedure. Once in their squadron there is a great deal of time dedicated to
further training and exercises. I hope police departments invest the money
to allow their pilots to train on a continual basis.


Take these comments and those I made above. One primary mission of Marine av
iators in close air support (CAS) of ground troops. Marines go through (or
at least used to) 9 months of Trooper Basic School. I will bet Marine Hornet
and Harrier pilots get more CAS training during their respective syllabi,
and still more when they reach their squadrons. They don't take a person,
tell them, "You be a ground-pounder for a few years, and then we'll send you
to flight school." To make the point another way, there have been people
who have washed out of flight school and become ground pounders, but not the
other way around.

My point is not to simply hire someone to be a pilot and NOT give them any
law enforcement training. Quite the contrary. However, take two people, and
all things being equal, how long would it take to produce a pilot and how
long would it take to produce a police officer? You asked how long before a
person is "let loose" with an F/A-18. How about a patrol car and a gun?



One law enforcement agency that hires people to be pilots is the US
Customs
Service. Yes, you attend their academy (16 weeks, I think), become a
sworn
officer, and carry a gun. Then you go straight to an aviation unit. There
is
nothing that states that a Customs officer could not become a pilot, if
they
meet the flight time minimums.

Do you know anyone in Customs? I do. Lots of problems because people
are thrust into a law enforcement job with no law enforcement
background.


Yes, I know a few. Have worked with them and flown with them. The flight
times they require for pilot applicants are just about right, in my opinion.
Why accept less when you can get someone experienced? Since Customs pilots
go through their academy, what "problems" are you referring to that couldn't
potentially affect ANY Customs agent, pilot or no. Can you elaborate?



I think it could be argued effectively that an experienced pilot,
especially
one with a military background (no slight intended toward civilian
pilots),
could learn a patrolman's job faster than a patrolman could become a
pilot's. Some in this thread may disagree, but I'll stand by my
statement.

The only way you learn it is spending time on the streets.


By the same token, the only way to learn to be a safe, effective pilot is by
spending time in the cockpit.


While I may have philosophical differences with certain aspects of law
enforcement aviation. My comments should in no way imply that I am "anti"
any area of that field or the people in it. Fly safe, all!