"Keith Willshaw" wrote:
| "Brett" wrote in message
| ...
| "Keith Willshaw" wrote:
| | "Brett" wrote in message
| | ...
| | wrote:
| | | A number of posts mentioned that 747s are capable of in-flight
| | | refueling. Is this correct for 'all' 747s or just the
particular
| | | military versions (E-4) & AF1? I suspect it would be unusual
to
| see a
| | | civilian 747 doing so.
| |
| | At a cost greater than $19 a gallon I don't believe any airline
| would
| | even consider it an option.
| |
| |
| |
| | Today the limit with most civil aircraft is crew endurance anyway
|
| "crew endurance" - they can carry relief crews, the limit would be
what
| the "cattle in the back" are willing to endure.
|
|
| Actually crew endurance is a problem, rest facilities are usually only
| available for flight crews not the cabin crew which on a 747 or 777
| may be quite large.
|
| I have flown from the UK to Australia with stops at Bahrain
andSingapore
| that meant 2 crew changes each doing about 8 hours, we "cattle in the
back"
| were there for more than 24

So the limit would be at least 24 hours and the number of relief crews
available.

| | but in times gone by it has been used for civil aircraft. In 1939
| | an Imperial Airways flying boat operated non stop across the
| | North Atlantic being refuelled in mid air by a converted Harrow
| | bomber operated by Flight Refuelling Ltd.
|
| And within a month of the demonstration Britain was at war, Imperial
| Airways had been nationalized and the service was used for high
priority
| passengers/cargo where "cost" was not a major consideration.
|
|
| The trials pre-dated the outbreak of war however

By a month __On 5 August 1939, The Cabot, a Short C Class flying boat,
took off from Shannon, Ireland and received 1200 gallons of fuel shortly
after takeoff from an Armstrong Whitworth AW-23 tanker on its Western
flight to Botwood, Newfoundland. After a short ground refueling stop at
Botwood, the flight continued on to Montreal, Canada, and to its
destination of New York City. On the Eastbound leg from Botwood, The
Cabot received 1,200 gallons of fuel from a tanker based at Gander,
Newfoundland. A total of sixteen crossings were made and the success of
these trials led to a decision to add two or three flying boats to the
service and continue operations in 1940.__

http://www.au.af.mil/au/database/pro...ugherty_sj.pdf

| and the cost was
| considered less than the alternatives which were limited.

What was the cost of delivering 1200 gallons of fuel to an aircraft in
flight? What was the average cost for each passenger with and without
inflight refueling, how large a subsididy was the British Government
willing to pay in peacetime/wartime, how much would a passenger be
willing to pay in peacetime.
Then ask yourself what $19 per gallon would do what to the seat mile
costs of a modern airliner (airlines get upset with 30 cent price
variations).

| Land planes
| could stop in Iceland and Goosebay but in winter this wasnt an
| option for flying boats.

How attractive is Botwood in winter?