"Stuart Wilkes" wrote in message
om...
"Actual Oxyclean User" wrote in message
. net...

snip

You need to be a little more specific about bravery when you talk about
the
Russians.

Indeed.

Much of their bravery came at the muzzle of an NKVD rifle.

Actually Mark, only a tiny bit of it came from NKVD rifles, since
there was very little NKVD to go around.

But enough to instill fear...which was the main objective anyway.

There was no NKVD when
Zhukov trounded the Japanese.

And there was no NKVD when millions of Russians ran as fast as their little
feet could carry them in front of the advancing Barbarossa frat house party.

There was no NKVD when Col.
Polosukhin's 32nd Rifle Division gutted 40th Panzercorps at Borodino.
There was no NKVD when Col. Katukov's 4th Tank Bde sliced and diced
4th Panzer Division on the approach to Tula. further examples can be
supplied.

So there's another one of your spiteful lies exposed.

The Moscow panic was brutally surpressed by the NKVD.

Apparently, Mark would prefer it if it had spread. What alternative
was there?


Communication? Apparently this is an abstract concept for Russians. Still
is.

If you didn't work long hard hours in those factories, you could be
shot.

Apparently, Mark would prefer it if those factories had produced less.
What alternative was there?


In the US we didn't seem to have a problem. We didn't trump up phoney
charges to get free slave labor. Not even interned Japanese were subjected
to forced labor. The worst the German POWs had it was working in vegetable
gardens to grow their own food. I guess that's why so many German POWs
didn't want to be repatriated. Willy Von Braun didn't think it was so bad
here.

NKVD units were generally interspersed with regular units.

Yeah, around one battalion per Front. That works out to about 1% of
the force.

Anyone not showing sufficient enthusiasm
for marching into a Nazi machine gun nest would be shot in the back.

Yet another spiteful lie. No denying that it happened occasionally,
but it was far from "anyone".


But no such "NKVD" units accompanied American soldiers, not even 1%.

The end of the war did not bring relief

Sure it did. No Germans killing people by the tens of millions, after
all.


And the Soviets simply picked up where the Nazis left off.

but did bring into being the gulag system of slave labor.

Then there is the issue of the Russians that welcomed the Nazis hoping
to
get rid of the Communists. Ukranians, although not Russians, were often

A minority were. But from the vast majority, the Germans got nothing
but hatred and opposition. Hence the unsustainable casualties the
Germans suffered, from the very start of the war.


Nyet. Byelorussians, Ukranians and Balts were quite happy to see the Nazis
march into their towns...as were many Russians. The problem arose in the
fact that there were two competing philosophies in the German military...one
that wanted to "allie" with the conquered and the hardliners who took a more
racist approach. The hardliners won out. You know this very well Stuey so
quit the smoke screen.

quite happy to see the Germans,

Oh yeah, I remember the staged newsreels of people lined up neatly in
front of villages and then running simultaneously towards German tanks
to greet them. I don't buy anything so hokey, but it's no suprise
that you do.


Yes, of course. You were there and interviewed every person. Opinion, not
fact. This is why nobody should believe any of your "history". You are
incapable of separating your personal bias from historical fact.

The reality is that the Germans found the most bitter, determined
resistance they had run into up to that point in the war when they
attacked the USSR.


No. When the Germans attacked the USSR, they ran and surrendered by the
millions. This is historical fact. Determined resitance did not happen until
Stalingrad....and only because Stalin decided to make a meat grinder out of
it i.e. the Soviets sent there to fight had no choice in the matter.

especially remembering that Stalin's famine
caused about 4 million of them to die.

While Chechans were storming the Reichstag, their families back home
were
being deported to Siberia.

And where were Japanese-Americans when Lt. Daniel Inoue was wounded in
the action that got him a Distinguished Service Cross?


They were be given food, clothing and shelter and protective custody. How
many of those Japanese-Americans returned to Japan after the war?
Another Stuey smoke screen where you try to cast one isolated incident as
general policy. This sounds like Stuey hipocrisy to me. According to you,
the Soviets were justified in committing mass murder during the Moscow panic
but the US was wrong to gather together potential saboteurs. This double
standard is nothing new for you.

Stuart Wilkes, apologist for mass murder.