On Thursday, July 3, 2014 5:42:42 PM UTC-7, SoaringXCellence wrote:
I know PowerFlarm and ADS-B have been discussed all over the net, but I was thinking today about something that I haven't seen (or been able to find):



We have a PowerFlarm with a (apparently) good GPS system installed, Altitude encoder, and NMEA data stream output.



We have a bunch of ADS-B (out) capable transponders that will be going into aircraft in the next few years (at least the only one I'm willing to install is going to have that capability).



EXCEPT we don't have a FAA approved GPS data source for the ADS-B out function available without installing another (read that expensive) GPS device in our crowded panel.



SO, is there any ongoing effort to get approval for the PF GPS to be used to supply the NMEA data for the ADS-B out on the transponder?



Logic would propose that the glider community, or PF designers, or TXP companies might work together to get this important function easily implemented in the glider fleet.



Is there any such effort that anyone is aware of? Participating in? Would like to support or participate in? ETC.



MB

Nice wishful thinking, here is some sting of reality for you...

You want to equip a certified aircraft (including glider) in the USA with ADS-B data-out you need a FSDO field approval for the install, and the FAA prefers that to be based on an existing ADS-B out STC (none of which were ever developed for gliders, but hopefully you woudl base on one for GA aircraft using similar GPS source and ADS-B our device). Any install is required to meet the FAA's 2020 carriage mandate specification, even as in the case of gliders that are not otherwise required to so equip with ADS-B data-out by 2020.

For approval in a certified aircraft, including glider, the GPS position sensor driving ADS-B Out must meet one of a number of different IFR GPS TSO approvals, in practice anybody installing ADS-B Out in a certified glider today will need to use a TSO-C145a (or later) IFR/WAAS GPS receiver. Suitable products today include the Accord Technology NexNav Mini and the FreeFlight Systems 1201. Current street prices are just under $3,000 for the FreeFlight Systems 1201. That is just for the GPS receiver. You have to add a Mode S transponder capable of 1090ES Out and installation costs.

The situation for experiential aircraft, including gliders, is a bit different. You should be able to do an install with a non TSO-compliant GPS source. But contact and work with the manufacture on doing this and especially on making sure that the ADS-B out SIL and other settings correctly reflect the reduced GPS source specifications. What a non-complaint install actually mens for receiving ADS-R and TIS-B services from the FAA ADS-B ground infrastructure is unfortunately unclear, but I'd just not assume everything will just work. Please don't screw around with this unless you know what you are doing, the FAA may come knocking on your door (I understand the FAA are contacting aircraft owners now where incorrect ADS-B installations are detected).

The long term ADS-B data-out solution here will come as the price of TSO-C145 GPS sources falls and/or transponder manufacturers integrate those GPS sources into the ADS-B out transponder. Whether that will ever be low enough in price to be attractive to many glider owners will need to be seen. Folks at FLARM have much more sense than worry about trying to make a TSO-C145 certified GPS source for the tiny USA FLARM+ADS-B Data Out market. And this is not just something you "seek approval" for, the entire consumer-chipset GPS guts of the current FLARM devices would need to be replaced and to meet TSO approval the GPS data interconnect would be based on ARINC 429 not NEMA.