JJ,

I want to reply in full later, but I will just say now that there is a
distinction to be made between spin accidents while training, and spin
accidents while doing deliberate spins for training purposes.

Of the six Puchacz fatal accidents in the U.K.:

The one this year on 18th January is still being investigated.

The one at Camphill on 21st February 2003 was due to the glider hitting the
winch wire while another glider was being launched (i.e. a form of mid-air
collision); stalling or spinning were not factors.

The remaining four were all stall/spin accidents, only the first at Usk on
4th August 1990 was a deliberate spin. That flight was launched by
aerotow, the pilot in command was the club Chief Flying instructor, and the
pupil was a qualified Assistant Instructor being coached for the Full
Instructor Rating. The spin was entered at about 1200 to 1400 ft and was
deliberately continuous from there, recovery was not started until about
250ft or less, which is of course too low. This type of low level
continuous spin is of course now advised against in the quotation from the
BGA Instructors' Manual which I have already given, first published in 1994.

I do not have the facilities or access to search the U.K. accidents
database, but I do not know of a single glider accident, in any type of
glider, in the U.K. caused by a deliberate spin entry (i.e. stall with
wing-drop) below !000 ft. If anyone knows of one such, could they please
tell me, either on this board or by e-mail.

W.J. (Bill) Dean (U.K.).
Remove "ic" to reply.


"JJ Sinclair" wrote in message
...

Bill Dean,

The tone of the spin discussion has taken a rather harsh turn, lately. I
may be responsible for some of it, because I allowed myself to be sucked
into a discussion of gun control, socialized medicine, slavery and Oh yes,
spins. The harsh tone was not my intention and my posts have been in a
sincere belief that your spin training is outmoded.

You asked about my qualifications to address this issue. I have spent a
lifetime in the air and will turn 70 this year, if I can still recognize
the signs of impending departure from controlled flight, for another
summer. I have flown sailplanes for 30 years and logged over 4000 hours,
mostly in cross country flight. I have owned over 40 ships and flown
most of what's out there, including G-103, ASK-13, ASK-21, two-place Lark,
Puch, Blanik. I have stalled and done spin entry in all of them and even
took the ASK-13 on a cross country (won't do that again). I served as
safety officer of our club (450 members) for 10 years. The only spin
accidents I can remember in my 30 years soaring in Northern California is
a single place Lark (fatal), PZL-59 (impact absorbed by tree branches,
pilot walked away) and recently a PW-5 (impact absorbed by tree branches,
pilot walked away). God bless those trees!

I served as a staff officer at TAC Hq. in the USAF and one of my duties
was to review all reconnaissance accidents in the command. I remember
one vividly. RF-4C was lost practicing a pop-up manoeuvre. The
Director of Operations wanted to know why we were still teaching that
manoeuvre because new equipment and tactics made it no longer necessary.
The training syllabus was changed and pop-up manoeuvres were no longer
taught. I believe you may have allowed your glider training to fall into
the same situation. New German ships (both single seaters and 2-place)
have rather docile spin characteristics. I question the need to do spins
in ships like the Puch, at all? Here in the US, we no longer require
spin training, due to excessive spin training accidents. I do believe
most sailplane instructors still teach spin recognition and spin avoidance
(recovery within 1 revolution).

Now, don't tense up, it's just a suggestion, but if the US had the UK spin
training accidents, I would raise the red flag as high as I could get it.
I would call for a complete review of how we teach spins, what ships we do
it in and and how we taught spins. I would ask for a complete review of
the training materials with an eye on removing things like deliberately
initiating a spin at 800 feet. Our gliding environment isn't as rigid as
yours, but we find some, "Monkey-See, Monkey-Do", over here in the
colonies. If a low time pilot sees the local "Hot-Shot", come screaming
over the glider tie-down area at 5 feet and 150 knots, he may very well
try it himself, but not have the experience to pull it off. The same
might happen when a sailplane is seen deliberately spun in the pattern,
don't you think?

Old ways die hard, Bill. The US Army kept a detachment of cavalry
throughout World War 2, just in case those tanks didn't work out.

Best Regards,
JJ Sinclair.