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Old December 9th 06, 11:45 PM posted to rec.aviation.military.naval
Ralph_S
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Default New NavAir Changes


Mike Weeks wrote:
Ralph_S wrote:
R Leonard wrote:



Is this anything new? While in my opinion it would make more sense for
them to try to revive the legacy of one of the former adversary units,
I really don't see the problem with this. I think it is great to see
The Sundowners name revived.

It's been done before. VF-2 (now VFA-2) harked back to the original
VF-2 that flew from the Langley, including using the so-called Langley
strips.


Please keep in mind that VF/VFA-2 did not attempt to use as the
official patch the original "Flying Chiefs" patch and in addition they
are officially called the "Bounty Hunters".

Using the Langley strips simply acknowledges that there was previously
another fleet carrier squadron Number Two.

The patch they used indeed wasn't that of the Flying Chiefs, but it
definately tied into the original VF-2 from the Langley (There's even a
biplane in there), as did the Langley stripes.


http://www.lemoore.navy.mil/cvw-2/cvw2squadrons.htm

VF-103 Sluggers became The Jolly Rogers when VF-84 was disestablished,
and that unit didn't have a direct lineage back to the original VF-17
either.


And that decision came from the very top. Instead of the CNO simply
keeping VF-84, VF-103 was _told_ they are to change patch and official
nickname. IIRC CNO ADM Johnson was quoted as stating in so many words
the Navy tracked its squadrons not on type and numbers, but by patchs
and nicknames. This of course is inaccurate.

Well, you had VF-17 Jolly Rogers. This was stood down. Some of it's
personel became part of a new unit, VF-84, which called itself the
Jolly Rogers as well. Around the same time, VF-17 is stood up gain
under the same name, gets renumbered as VF-5B and later VF-61. Now you
have two squadrons named the Jolly Rogers.
VF-84 is disestablished, while VF-61 remains. VF-84 is re-established
as the Vagabonds. VF-61 is disestablished. VF-84 is once again named
the Jolly Rogers.
VF-84 is disestablished. VF-103 becomes the Jolly Rogers.

This sort of thing really is only relevant to aviation geeks such as
myself and historians.

The decision will simply add additional confusion to the proper lineage
history of former squadrons (such as what's happened w/ VF/VFA-11 "Red
Rippers", based on what had been the established rules, regs and
instructions.


While there may be official guidelines for this sort of thing, it
doesn't seem as though they are applied very consistently.

Cheers,
Ralph

MW