Go-arounds

Just curious... do airliners view go-arounds unfavorably against
pilots in, say, their appraisals or performance reports?

Ramapriya

I have never been associated with an airline, but having been in the
aviation education business for over 40 years I can tell you that going
around from a questionable approach is a sign of good judgment...crashing to
avoid going around is to be avoided.

Bob Gardner

"Ramapriya" wrote in message
om...
Just curious... do airliners view go-arounds unfavorably against
pilots in, say, their appraisals or performance reports?

Ramapriya

"Ramapriya" wrote in message do airliners view go-arounds unfavorably
against pilots in, say, their appraisals or performance reports?

It depends on the reason for the go-around. Some go-arounds are because
controllers get the spacing too tight as we come down the pipeline. Some
go-arounds are because the plane in front of us didn't expedite off the
runway as the controller requested. Some go-arounds are because an
inattentive pilot or truck driver committed a runway incursion in front of a
landing plane. Even for those go-arounds were the pilot is at blame, a
go-around displays better judgement than continuing a landing and making a
bad situation worse.

D.

In article
,
"Capt.Doug" wrote:

"Ramapriya" wrote in message do airliners view go-arounds unfavorably
against pilots in, say, their appraisals or performance reports?

It depends on the reason for the go-around. Some go-arounds are because
controllers get the spacing too tight as we come down the pipeline. Some
go-arounds are because the plane in front of us didn't expedite off the
runway as the controller requested. Some go-arounds are because an
inattentive pilot or truck driver committed a runway incursion in front of a
landing plane. Even for those go-arounds were the pilot is at blame, a
go-around displays better judgement than continuing a landing and making a
bad situation worse.

e.g.:

http://www.airdisaster.com/cgi_bin/v...052000&reg=N66
8SW&airline=Southwest+Airlines

rg

In article ,
Ron Garret wrote:

It depends on the reason for the go-around. Some go-arounds are because
controllers get the spacing too tight as we come down the pipeline. Some
go-arounds are because the plane in front of us didn't expedite off the
runway as the controller requested. Some go-arounds are because an
inattentive pilot or truck driver committed a runway incursion in front of a
landing plane. Even for those go-arounds were the pilot is at blame, a
go-around displays better judgement than continuing a landing and making a
bad situation worse.

I was a passenger some years ago on a United something coming up the Bay
into SFO, probably 28L or 28R, that did a go-around for one of these
reasons. I realized what was happening, but was still slightly
white-knuckled over how long it seemed to take for the engines to get
spooled back up and the aircraft to stop descending, level off, and
start climbing out. Not at all like the feeling of climbing up off the
runway following rotation on takeoff.

AES/newspost wrote:
In article ,
Ron Garret wrote:


It depends on the reason for the go-around. Some go-arounds are because
controllers get the spacing too tight as we come down the pipeline. Some
go-arounds are because the plane in front of us didn't expedite off the
runway as the controller requested. Some go-arounds are because an
inattentive pilot or truck driver committed a runway incursion in front of a
landing plane. Even for those go-arounds were the pilot is at blame, a
go-around displays better judgement than continuing a landing and making a
bad situation worse.


I was a passenger some years ago on a United something coming up the Bay
into SFO, probably 28L or 28R, that did a go-around for one of these
reasons. I realized what was happening, but was still slightly
white-knuckled over how long it seemed to take for the engines to get
spooled back up and the aircraft to stop descending, level off, and
start climbing out. Not at all like the feeling of climbing up off the
runway following rotation on takeoff.
I don't understand the issue. A "go around" is a standard proceedure
which as a pilot, I have executed a number of times. If things aren't
"right", you go around.

I have been on several commercial flights (major airlines) where the
pilot has made the same decision. The major problem there is the wasted
fuel and lowered profits.

When in doubt, go 'round.

"Ron Garret" wrote

Even for those go-arounds were the pilot is at blame, a
go-around displays better judgement than continuing a landing and making
a
bad situation worse.

So is a screw up like that a career ender for both the pilots? Opinions?
Doug? Others?
--
Jim in NC


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"Morgans" wrote in message So is a screw up
like that a career ender for both the pilots? Opinions? Doug? Others?

The usual way it works is for the airline to terminate the pilots and let
the union try to get them reinstated. Every case is different from that
point. I've seen cases that involved remedial training and I've seen cases
that involved certificate revocation.

If the termination is upheld, the pilot likely won't be working at another
airline for quite some time. The Pilot Records Improvement Act of 1996 was
enacted for this reason. The Act covers a pilot's previous 5 years of
commercial flying.

Additionally, commercial aviation is a small community. I don't hire charter
pilots if I can't call a contact in the business and get a good
recommendation on them.

D.

Recently, Capt.Doug posted:

"Morgans" wrote in message So is a
screw up
like that a career ender for both the pilots? Opinions? Doug?
Others?

The usual way it works is for the airline to terminate the pilots and
let the union try to get them reinstated. Every case is different
from that point. I've seen cases that involved remedial training and
I've seen cases that involved certificate revocation.

If the termination is upheld, the pilot likely won't be working at
another airline for quite some time. The Pilot Records Improvement
Act of 1996 was enacted for this reason. The Act covers a pilot's
previous 5 years of commercial flying.

Additionally, commercial aviation is a small community. I don't hire
charter pilots if I can't call a contact in the business and get a
good recommendation on them.

So... are you saying that a go-around is considered a "screw-up" in the
business? Or, is the pilot "to blame" if there isn't some other obvious
(and documentable) reason for a go-around, such as a runway incursion? It
seems to me that such practices would encourage poor judgement, if
judgement is considered a blame-able offense.

Neil

Morgans wrote:
"Ron Garret" wrote

Even for those go-arounds were the pilot is at blame, a

go-around displays better judgement than continuing a landing and making

a

bad situation worse.


So is a screw up like that a career ender for both the pilots? Opinions?
Doug? Others?

If go arounds were career enders there would be no RJ pilots left
anymore. I have seen some of the most pathetic descent planning by the
pilots of Skywest(Delta and United) and Air Shuttle(America West). They
have been given visual approach and landing clearances 40 miles out and
cannot get down. Nobody to follow just fly to the airport and land.
Can't do it. God forbid he's number three, he'll end up on a ten mile
final at 7000 AGL asking for 360's.