Low Cost Dual Band ADS-B Receiver

Check out the new pingBuddy2 dual band ADS-B receiver from UAVIONIX:

http://www.uavionix.com/products/pingbuddy2/

$149. Works with a wide variety of iPhone and iPAD aps, including Foreflight, FltPlan Go, WingX, etc.

Provides weather, and traffic (both ADS-B equipped A/C, and Mode C/S transponder traffic via TIS-B). Note: To reliably see traffic you need to be ADS-B OUT equipped.

If you already have a TRIG transponder, add the new TN72 GPS position source for ~$500, the pingBuddy2 for $149, and the free FltPlan Go app on your iPhone, and you have a complete collision avoidance system that will show you every transponder equipped aircraft in your vicinity with voice alerts for anyone getting too close.

If you don't have a transponder yet, this will give you a great excuse to buy one.

Mike,

1. Explain exactly how you get useful ADS-B out in an experimental glider. Key word is USEFUL. Without it, ADS-B in is seriously handicapped.

2. Oh, and a PowerFLARM hooked up to an Oudie "will show you every transponder equipped aircraft in your vicinity with voice alerts for anyone getting too close" for considerably less. Mine has been doing it for a few years now.

Kirk

For an experimental glider, its allowed to connect any GPS to your Trig22, and broadcast adsb-out as a 'non performing emitter'. I use my LXNav flight computer as a gps source, its a one-wire connection to the Trig. Be sure to go through the Trig setup and select an 'unapproved gps'. If you have problems, ask Trig, they were very helpful to me.

Sadly, I understand ATC will not presently relay the positions of non-performing-emitters to other aircraft, but big planes will see my Trig22 anyway. But a cheap certified GPS will come along. I'm still waiting to hear the actual cost of a TN72.

In my opinion, transponder and adsb is the best way to invest money, for gliders in the USA. Flarm is arguably better now, but that will change as lower cost adsb systems surely come along. The clinching argument (to me, that I read here on RAS) was to hear that Flarm is not useful in a gaggle, only to warn of gliders approaching the gaggle.

On Friday, February 3, 2017 at 4:13:14 PM UTC-8, wrote:
For an experimental glider, its allowed to connect any GPS to your Trig22, and broadcast adsb-out as a 'non performing emitter'. I use my LXNav flight computer as a gps source, its a one-wire connection to the Trig. Be sure to go through the Trig setup and select an 'unapproved gps'. If you have problems, ask Trig, they were very helpful to me.

Sadly, I understand ATC will not presently relay the positions of non-performing-emitters to other aircraft, but big planes will see my Trig22 anyway. But a cheap certified GPS will come along. I'm still waiting to hear the actual cost of a TN72.

In my opinion, transponder and adsb is the best way to invest money, for gliders in the USA. Flarm is arguably better now, but that will change as lower cost adsb systems surely come along. The clinching argument (to me, that I read here on RAS) was to hear that Flarm is not useful in a gaggle, only to warn of gliders approaching the gaggle.

TN72 GPS $359 & TA70 Amplified Antenna $318

Distributor says available Mid April 2017

You can preorder at http://www.craggyaero.com/trig.htm

Richard
www.craggyaero.com

On Friday, February 3, 2017 at 4:13:14 PM UTC-8, wrote:
For an experimental glider, its allowed to connect any GPS to your Trig22, and broadcast adsb-out as a 'non performing emitter'. I use my LXNav flight computer as a gps source, its a one-wire connection to the Trig. Be sure to go through the Trig setup and select an 'unapproved gps'. If you have problems, ask Trig, they were very helpful to me.

Sadly, I understand ATC will not presently relay the positions of non-performing-emitters to other aircraft, but big planes will see my Trig22 anyway. But a cheap certified GPS will come along. I'm still waiting to hear the actual cost of a TN72.

In my opinion, transponder and adsb is the best way to invest money, for gliders in the USA. Flarm is arguably better now, but that will change as lower cost adsb systems surely come along. The clinching argument (to me, that I read here on RAS) was to hear that Flarm is not useful in a gaggle, only to warn of gliders approaching the gaggle.

Flarm is quite useful in a gaggle, while ADS-B will be completely useless. If there are 20 sailplanes in the gaggle, then just about anything looks pretty cluttered, including the view out the window. With 10 or less in a gaggle, and a good tactical display, you have excellent situational awareness.

If, theoretically, all those '10 or less in a gaggle' are equipped with ADS-B Out and In, and 'a good tactical display', will the information/warnings provided be still inferior to that of FLARM? Just curious...

Tom BravoMike

On Friday, February 3, 2017 at 6:23:50 PM UTC-8, Tom BravoMike wrote:
If, theoretically, all those '10 or less in a gaggle' are equipped with ADS-B Out and In, and 'a good tactical display', will the information/warnings provided be still inferior to that of FLARM? Just curious...

Absolutely. ADS-B only provides a 3D position, so all the nearby gliders in the thermal will be considered a threat. FLARM provides a position and a predicted future position, so only potential collisions produce an alert.

5Z

If ADS-B/In provides the 3D information, which is next used in a variety of softwa ForeFlight, iFlyGPS, XCSoar (pending, hopefully), what can stop the programmers to calculate potential collisions and give similar alerts to those of FLARM? Isn't it all about universality of the system and availability of reliable data between ALL users of the airspace: powerplanes, gliders, trikes AND drones?

Tom BravoMike

On Friday, February 3, 2017 at 6:23:50 PM UTC-8, Tom BravoMike wrote:
If, theoretically, all those '10 or less in a gaggle' are equipped with ADS-B Out and In, and 'a good tactical display', will the information/warnings provided be still inferior to that of FLARM? Just curious...

Tom BravoMike

Yes, ADS-B will be inferior for a variety of reasons:

1) ADS-B doesn't do path prediction on the transmit side (straight, turning, climbing, descending, etc.). FLARM does.

2) ADS-B doesn't provide collision warning. For glider scenarios, this is almost impossible to do without some form of #1. At best a computer using ADS-B could give traffic alerts based on proximity, which for glider scenarios would generate a lot of false alarms if you tried to use it for anything beyond simple proximity alerts.

3) Most of the collision warning processing is done by FLARM, not the display. Imagine the challenges and confusion potential if each display used its own collision warning algorithm. Since there is no provision in the ADS-B specification for anything other than absolute position display based on GPS location. FLARM sends RELATIVE position and collision warnings to all displays so there is no ambiguity. In addition, there is no plan to provide this functionality that I am aware of across display manufacturers.

4) FLARM de-duplicates FLARM and ADS-B 1090ES and Mode-S transponder traffic based on ICAO ID. If you go a la carte, you would need to do this within each display. There are no plans that I am aware of to do this.

I'm sure there are other challenges. I do think it would be useful to MUX UAT (and possibly TIS-B) traffic into a FLARM NMEA stream, but it has challenges. I'd take whatever FLARM provides natively first, add a transponder second and then see if I need anything else, like ADS-B Out, TIS-B, UAT, or FIS-B (for weather radar, TFRs, etc - but that's a whole new set of display challenges).

9B

Since there is no provision in the ADS-B specification for anything other than absolute position display based on GPS location.

The ADS-B specification requires transmitting 3D velocity vector along with absolute position.

Marc