Cessna 182 or 182RG tips?

Our club is worried that we're not going to be able to get insurance for
our Lance any more. (We had to switch to a named pilot policy this year,
previously anybody in the club could fly it if they met the currency and
checkout requirements.) Plus the Lance is going to need a new engine next
year, and we don't want to put $25K+ into a new engine if we won't be able
to keep the plane for more than a year or two.

So now we're looking at replacements, and one type of plane that people
keep mentioning as a possibility is the C-182 or C-182RG, because it has
similar performance to our Dakota, but better interior room. I've never
flown a high wing before. Is there any tips or hints you could give me to
help the transition?

--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
....I'm not one of those who think Bill Gates is the devil. I simply
suspect that if Microsoft ever met up with the devil, it wouldn't need an
interpreter. -- Nick Petreley

"Paul Tomblin" wrote:
So now we're looking at replacements, and one type of plane that
people
keep mentioning as a possibility is the C-182 or C-182RG, because it
has
similar performance to our Dakota, but better interior room. I've
never
flown a high wing before. Is there any tips or hints you could give
me to
help the transition?

182s have a tendency to drop hard on the nose gear on landing if you
don't watch 'em. Be sure to add "up" elevator trim on short final and
carry just a little bit of power into the flare. Other than that, a
Skylane is your grandma's Oldsmobile.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

Dan Luke wrote:

"Paul Tomblin" wrote:

So now we're looking at replacements, and one type of plane that
people
keep mentioning as a possibility is the C-182 or C-182RG, because it
has
similar performance to our Dakota, but better interior room. I've
never
flown a high wing before. Is there any tips or hints you could give
me to
help the transition?


182s have a tendency to drop hard on the nose gear on landing if you
don't watch 'em. Be sure to add "up" elevator trim on short final and
carry just a little bit of power into the flare. Other than that, a
Skylane is your grandma's Oldsmobile.


It's funny as I'd heard this also and found the 182 to not have this
tendency any more than any other airplane I've flown. Then again, as
you know from another thread, I was taught to make full stall landings. :-)

I'm therefore quite used to pulling the nose up on landing until the
stall horn bleeps or until the mains touch. Hopefully, nearly
simultaneously.

If you fly the 182 like a 150, then sure you land on the nose as the 182
probably requires 3-4 times the pull on the yoke to stall before
touchdown. However, I was taught to fly the airplane by using whatever
control input is needed to get the attitude/performance desired, not to
fly by control force. If fly this way, then the 182 is, as you say,
your gramma's Olds.


Matt

"Matt Whiting" wrote:
182s have a tendency to drop hard on the nose gear on landing if you
don't watch 'em. Be sure to add "up" elevator trim on short final
and carry just a little bit of power into the flare. Other than
that, a Skylane is your grandma's Oldsmobile.


It's funny as I'd heard this also and found the 182 to not have this
tendency any more than any other airplane I've flown. Then again, as
you know from another thread, I was taught to make full stall
landings. :-)

Yes, it takes some mishandling to prang a 182's in this way.
Nevertheless, 182s are somewhat notorious for this - one of the first
things one checks on a used Skylane is the condition of the firewall for
hard landing damage.

I'm therefore quite used to pulling the nose up on landing until the
stall horn bleeps or until the mains touch. Hopefully, nearly
simultaneously.

No problem if judged correctly.

If you fly the 182 like a 150, then sure you land on the nose as the
182 probably requires 3-4 times the pull on the yoke to stall before
touchdown. However, I was taught to fly the airplane by using
whatever control input is needed to get the attitude/performance
desired, not to fly by control force. If fly this way, then the 182
is, as you say, your gramma's Olds.


Matt

"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...

"Matt Whiting" wrote:
182s have a tendency to drop hard on the nose gear on landing if you
don't watch 'em. Be sure to add "up" elevator trim on short final and
carry just a little bit of power into the flare. Other than that, a
Skylane is your grandma's Oldsmobile.


It's funny as I'd heard this also and found the 182 to not have this
tendency any more than any other airplane I've flown. Then again, as you
know from another thread, I was taught to make full stall landings. :-)

Yes, it takes some mishandling to prang a 182's in this way. Nevertheless,
182s are somewhat notorious for this - one of the first things one checks
on a used Skylane is the condition of the firewall for hard landing
damage.

All the more reason to get a 180 instead of the 182.

Capt. Geoffry Thorpe wrote:
/snip/
Yes, it takes some mishandling to prang a 182's in this way. Nevertheless,
182s are somewhat notorious for this - one of the first things one checks
on a used Skylane is the condition of the firewall for hard landing
damage.


All the more reason to get a 180 instead of the 182.



Sure, the 180's firewall is probably just fine. Now look at the tail,
the wingtips, the rear spar, the gear box...

Happy Flying!
Scott Skylane

Matt Whiting wrote:
It's funny as I'd heard this also and found the 182 to not have this
tendency any more than any other airplane I've flown. Then again, as
you know from another thread, I was taught to make full stall landings.
:-)
I'm therefore quite used to pulling the nose up on landing until the
stall horn bleeps or until the mains touch. Hopefully, nearly
simultaneously.

I land the 182 the same as Matt... full stall, power off, 40 deg flaps.
Airspeed control/pitch attitude is crucial.
Pattern entry airspeed of 70 kts (10 deg flaps)
Downwind to base airspeed 65 kts (20 deg flaps)
Base to final airspeed 60 kts (30 deg flaps)
Threshold crossing airspeed 55 kts (40 deg flaps)
Touchdown airspeed 45-50 kts

john smith wrote:

Matt Whiting wrote:

It's funny as I'd heard this also and found the 182 to not have this
tendency any more than any other airplane I've flown. Then again, as
you know from another thread, I was taught to make full stall
landings. :-)
I'm therefore quite used to pulling the nose up on landing until the
stall horn bleeps or until the mains touch. Hopefully, nearly
simultaneously.


I land the 182 the same as Matt... full stall, power off, 40 deg flaps.
Airspeed control/pitch attitude is crucial.
Pattern entry airspeed of 70 kts (10 deg flaps)
Downwind to base airspeed 65 kts (20 deg flaps)
Base to final airspeed 60 kts (30 deg flaps)
Threshold crossing airspeed 55 kts (40 deg flaps)
Touchdown airspeed 45-50 kts

Yep, that's pretty much what I did. I did fly a little faster than you
normally. I usually flew the pattern through base at 80 knots,
decreased to 70 on final as I dropped the flaps to 40 and then crossed
the threshold at 60-65 or so depending on weight. I never had a bad
landing in a Skylane using this technique. You definitely don't want to
come in at 80K in a Skylane or you will either float halfway down the
runway or you will wheelbarrow trying to force the airplane down. I
suspect this is how most 182 nosewheels get pranged. Fortunately, I was
taught by an old-timer who harped on airspeed control and wasn't afraid
to fly slow on approaches. It seems many younger CFIs get antsy if you
get below 80K in a 150 before you are above the runway.

Matt

Paul Tomblin wrote:
So now we're looking at replacements, and one type of plane that people
keep mentioning as a possibility is the C-182 or C-182RG, because it has
similar performance to our Dakota, but better interior room. I've never
flown a high wing before. Is there any tips or hints you could give me to
help the transition?

Cessnas as a general rule glide better than Pipers. I generally chop the
throttle on final when I'm still a couple of hundred feed shy of the
threshold... something I wait a while longer to do when I fly Cherokees.

Take offs are smoother also. In the Cherokees, you generally skip a couple of
times before you actually lift off unless you wait to rotate until you have
flying speed. In the Cessna, you can rotate once you accelerated to stall speed
and roll along on the two mains until the airplane flies itself off when it's
ready.

That being said, the 182/182RG/206/210 series are all markedly nose heavy. Like
the old Cherokee Six, they have the reputation of flying if you can get the
doors closed. Personally, I think the 210 is the best of the bunch... 165 knots
on about 13.5 gph... and it will carry six... if you put the wimmins in the back
seat.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

VE

Mortimer Schnerd, RN wrote:

Personally, I think the 210 is the best of the bunch... 165 knots
on about 13.5 gph... and it will carry six... if you put the wimmins in the back
seat.

Insuring 6 seats in a "rental" appears to be the problem. Trading a low
wing 6 seater for a high wing six seater doesnt do much to address that
problem.

Dave