Lost log books

I looked at an A36 and was thinking about buying it, but he lost the logs.
My question is how much does this usually decrease the value of the plane.

he's got zero logbooks for it?

start running.. away... very far away and as fast as you can..

BT

"Aluckyguess" wrote in message
...
I looked at an A36 and was thinking about buying it, but he lost the logs.
My question is how much does this usually decrease the value of the plane.

Without logs, how do you know the flight hours on the
airframe or engine? Without that, how do you comply with AD
notes?

But if the plane looks good and he can prove ownership, you
can re-create the logs from sources.

The FAA should have records on the airplane. Beech will
have records of manufacture and probably spare parts orders.

It is some detective work and some parts, such as engines
and props may need to be overhauled or replaced anyway.
Talk to a good A&P/AI who "knows the model" and do a little
research.

My guess is that the price should be adjusted $25,000 to
$100,000 lower than a "perfect" airplane to cover your
costs.

You will need a real annual inspection by YOUR mechanic, not
his. That will cost several thousand dollars, just for the
inspection and logbook research just to find out what MUST
be replaced or re-done.



--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"BT" wrote in message
...
| he's got zero logbooks for it?
|
| start running.. away... very far away and as fast as you
can..
|
| BT
|
| "Aluckyguess" wrote in message
| ...
| I looked at an A36 and was thinking about buying it, but
he lost the logs.
| My question is how much does this usually decrease the
value of the plane.
|
|
|

"Jim Macklin" wrote in message
...
Without logs, how do you know the flight hours on the
airframe or engine? Without that, how do you comply with AD
notes?

But if the plane looks good and he can prove ownership, you
He can and he has one annual done on it. The A/P had the hours in his
computer.

can re-create the logs from sources.

The FAA should have records on the airplane. Beech will
have records of manufacture and probably spare parts orders.
He has that disk and the number of the guy who owned the plane before him.

It is some detective work and some parts, such as engines
and props may need to be overhauled or replaced anyway.

He just did the prop it has 1 hour.

Talk to a good A&P/AI who "knows the model" and do a little
research.
I would do a complete annual using my mechanic as a pre buy.

My guess is that the price should be adjusted $25,000 to
That was my guess, that equates to about 20%
I dont think he will sell it at that price so it mute anyhow.

$100,000 lower than a "perfect" airplane to cover your
costs.

You will need a real annual inspection by YOUR mechanic, not
his. That will cost several thousand dollars, just for the
inspection and logbook research just to find out what MUST

I was thinking you could have a fun summer flying to all the places that
worked on the airplane re-creating the logs.
Would this be as good as original if done?
be replaced or re-done.




thanks
--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

"BT" wrote in message
...
| he's got zero logbooks for it?
|
| start running.. away... very far away and as fast as you
can..
|
| BT
|
| "Aluckyguess" wrote in message
| ...
| I looked at an A36 and was thinking about buying it, but
he lost the logs.
| My question is how much does this usually decrease the
value of the plane.
|
|
|

"Aluckyguess" :
I was thinking you could have a fun summer flying to all the places that
worked on the airplane re-creating the logs.
Would this be as good as original if done? be replaced or re-done.

God forbid, if anything happened while you were having that fun summer
flying all over the place re-creating logs and the plane were totaled,
would the insurance cover the full value if you the documentation was
incomplete? Why would you want to put yourself in that situation? It
isn't as if finding an A36 with complete documentation is difficult.

On Thu, 25 Jan 2007 09:20:06 -0700, unicate wrote:

"Aluckyguess" :
I was thinking you could have a fun summer flying to all the places that
worked on the airplane re-creating the logs.
Would this be as good as original if done? be replaced or re-done.

God forbid, if anything happened while you were having that fun summer
flying all over the place re-creating logs and the plane were totaled,
would the insurance cover the full value if you the documentation was
incomplete? Why would you want to put yourself in that situation? It
isn't as if finding an A36 with complete documentation is difficult.

While I agree having a complete set of logs for a given aircraft
is a desirable thing, in the event of a total loss, the insurance
company will pay the stated hull value regardless of whether
or not the aircraft has a "complete set of logs". The stipulations
of the policy will be followed to the letter, and typically, nowhere
in said policy does it say "we only agree to pay if you don't lose
your logs". You will have to prove the aircraft was in annual /
airworthy at the time of the loss, etc.

I'll also allow as how having logs missing on an aircraft doesn't
necessarily mean an automatic "pass" (i.e., forget it, go look for
another aircraft) but it does raise a flag while looking at an
aircraft I'm contemplating purchasing.

My "Murphy's Law" meter gets pegged over on the "what is the owner
trying to hide by claiming the logs have been lost" side of the
scale. 8^)

FWIW, my '54 C-170B had it's 1st log missing (several years worth,
from '54 to the early 60's) but had everything from then on. After
I had a look at the airplane and the rest of the logs, I reasoned that
there was sufficient documentation for decades of ownership /
operation and that I could live with not having the 1st logbook (it
was claimed to have been lost by the way).

My current aircraft ('54 C-180) has everything dating back to day
one, including the initial test flight entry by the Cessna test pilot
in 1954.

Bela P. Havasreti

I would see just what was required to get a valid set of
records before any money on the airplane sale changed hands.
You use all available data to create new logs, shop data and
records, parts receipts, just as long you can rely on the
data, the FAA will accept it. But sometimes you have to
re-do work and that can become very expensive.


"Aluckyguess" wrote in message
...
|
| "Jim Macklin" wrote
in message
| ...
| Without logs, how do you know the flight hours on the
| airframe or engine? Without that, how do you comply
with AD
| notes?
|
| But if the plane looks good and he can prove ownership,
you
| He can and he has one annual done on it. The A/P had the
hours in his
| computer.
|
| can re-create the logs from sources.
|
| The FAA should have records on the airplane. Beech will
| have records of manufacture and probably spare parts
orders.
| He has that disk and the number of the guy who owned the
plane before him.
|
| It is some detective work and some parts, such as
engines
| and props may need to be overhauled or replaced anyway.
|
| He just did the prop it has 1 hour.
|
| Talk to a good A&P/AI who "knows the model" and do a
little
| research.
| I would do a complete annual using my mechanic as a pre
buy.
|
| My guess is that the price should be adjusted $25,000 to
| That was my guess, that equates to about 20%
| I dont think he will sell it at that price so it mute
anyhow.
|
| $100,000 lower than a "perfect" airplane to cover your
| costs.
|
| You will need a real annual inspection by YOUR mechanic,
not
| his. That will cost several thousand dollars, just for
the
| inspection and logbook research just to find out what
MUST
|
| I was thinking you could have a fun summer flying to all
the places that
| worked on the airplane re-creating the logs.
| Would this be as good as original if done?
| be replaced or re-done.
|
|
|
|
| thanks
| --
| James H. Macklin
| ATP,CFI,A&P
|
| "BT" wrote in message
| ...
| | he's got zero logbooks for it?
| |
| | start running.. away... very far away and as fast as
you
| can..
| |
| | BT
| |
| | "Aluckyguess" wrote in message
| | ...
| | I looked at an A36 and was thinking about buying it,
but
| he lost the logs.
| | My question is how much does this usually decrease
the
| value of the plane.
| |
| |
| |
|
|
|
|

On Jan 24, 9:15 pm, "BT" wrote:
he's got zero logbooks for it?

start running.. away... very far away and as fast as you can..


It's perfectly reasonable that a well maintained plane could have it's
logbooks go missing.

The flight school I work at has all the logbooks for their planes
stored in one room by the maintenance hangar. If that thing goes up in
flames, the planes are no less flyable.

The flight school I work at has all the logbooks for their planes
stored in one room by the maintenance hangar. If that thing goes up in
flames, the planes are no less flyable.


I would hope someone was smart enough to buy a fire proof safe for that
room.
If they did go up in flames how would your student take their
checkride?
Lou

The flight school I work at has all the logbooks for their planes
stored in one room by the maintenance hangar. If that thing goes up in
flames, the planes are no less flyable.


I would hope someone was smart enough to buy a fire proof safe for that
room.

Great idea, but that would put them on a different "plane of reality" from
most places I recall working. Admittedly, none were aircraft
operators--but...

Peter