The right way?

Back in the training days of my PPL I had the bad habit of landing with a
some throttle still in (instead of power idle) and with little pitch
attitude. But the landings were always pretty smooth. Now I do what the
instructor taught me: cut off all power before threshold and raise the nose
wheel well up in the air during flare. In the final part I get the stall
warning tweet (as the instructor told it should be) and the result is a
somewhat rude main gear contact if the timing of the flare is not perfect.
Sure the plane stops in very little space (we operate on a 2000 feet
runway), but I get the feeling that I don't do it the right way since very
seldom I grease it out as I did before. Is just a matter of refining the
technic or am I missing something?

Steve wrote:
Back in the training days of my PPL I had the bad habit of landing with a
some throttle still in (instead of power idle) and with little pitch
attitude. But the landings were always pretty smooth. Now I do what the
instructor taught me: cut off all power before threshold and raise the nose
wheel well up in the air during flare. In the final part I get the stall
warning tweet (as the instructor told it should be) and the result is a
somewhat rude main gear contact if the timing of the flare is not perfect.
Sure the plane stops in very little space (we operate on a 2000 feet
runway), but I get the feeling that I don't do it the right way since very
seldom I grease it out as I did before. Is just a matter of refining the
technic or am I missing something?

It is a matter of continued practice. However, pretty much nobody gets
greasers all of the time. It is pretty hard for a human to react to a
gust of wind right before touchdown.

Matt

Be happy. You only get a greaser if you are a tad too fast. A max efficiency
landing is a plunker, and if there is any water on the runway it is just
what the doctor ordered.

Bob Gardner

"Steve" wrote in message
...
Back in the training days of my PPL I had the bad habit of landing with a
some throttle still in (instead of power idle) and with little pitch
attitude. But the landings were always pretty smooth. Now I do what the
instructor taught me: cut off all power before threshold and raise the
nose
wheel well up in the air during flare. In the final part I get the stall
warning tweet (as the instructor told it should be) and the result is a
somewhat rude main gear contact if the timing of the flare is not perfect.
Sure the plane stops in very little space (we operate on a 2000 feet
runway), but I get the feeling that I don't do it the right way since very
seldom I grease it out as I did before. Is just a matter of refining the
technic or am I missing something?

In article ,
Steve wrote:

Back in the training days of my PPL I had the bad habit of landing with a
some throttle still in (instead of power idle) and with little pitch
attitude. But the landings were always pretty smooth. Now I do what the
instructor taught me: cut off all power before threshold and raise the nose
wheel well up in the air during flare. In the final part I get the stall
warning tweet (as the instructor told it should be) and the result is a
somewhat rude main gear contact if the timing of the flare is not perfect.
Sure the plane stops in very little space (we operate on a 2000 feet
runway), but I get the feeling that I don't do it the right way since very
seldom I grease it out as I did before. Is just a matter of refining the
technic or am I missing something?


That is the best way to land under normal circumstances. Remember: the
nose gear is NOT a LANDING gear! Too often I see Bonanza drivers (some
of them high-time airline types) carrying 90 kt or more on approach and
landing with very little flare.

The old Bonanzas would fly a very nice approach at 8-85 mph and
three-point all the time.

The exceptions to the above a

1. high crosswinds, where you keep the speed up and land with power and
reduced (or no) flap
2. short field
3. soft field
4. windshear conditions
5. airframe ice
6. landing into the setting sun, where you fly a very flat approach and
feel the for runway.
7. probably a few conditions that I missed.

Yes, you can make three-point squeakers, but not all the time!

Sounds like you are leveling off a tad too high. Since you have been
used to making flat landings, the new sight picture (or lack of) is
probably making all the difference. Instead of looking straight ahead,
try to look sideways. Use your peripheral visiion to focus some
attention on the pavement through your side window.

In article . com,
"Andrew Sarangan" wrote:

Sounds like you are leveling off a tad too high. Since you have been
used to making flat landings, the new sight picture (or lack of) is
probably making all the difference. Instead of looking straight ahead,
try to look sideways. Use your peripheral visiion to focus some
attention on the pavement through your side window.

This also referred to as the taildragger technique. :-)

On Tue, 08 Nov 2005 00:24:24 GMT, Orval Fairbairn
wrote:

In article ,
Steve wrote:

Back in the training days of my PPL I had the bad habit of landing with a
some throttle still in (instead of power idle) and with little pitch
attitude. But the landings were always pretty smooth. Now I do what the
instructor taught me: cut off all power before threshold and raise the nose
wheel well up in the air during flare. In the final part I get the stall
warning tweet (as the instructor told it should be) and the result is a
somewhat rude main gear contact if the timing of the flare is not perfect.
Sure the plane stops in very little space (we operate on a 2000 feet
runway), but I get the feeling that I don't do it the right way since very
seldom I grease it out as I did before. Is just a matter of refining the
technic or am I missing something?


That is the best way to land under normal circumstances. Remember: the
nose gear is NOT a LANDING gear! Too often I see Bonanza drivers (some
of them high-time airline types) carrying 90 kt or more on approach and
landing with very little flare.

The old Bonanzas would fly a very nice approach at 8-85 mph and
three-point all the time.

The exceptions to the above a

1. high crosswinds, where you keep the speed up and land with power and

No need to keep the speed up in cross winds unless they are gusty and
half the gust component is fine.

You can still keep the nose gear off the pavement down to about 40 MPH
even with cross winds near the planes limit.

reduced (or no) flap

I find full flaps work really well in a Bo in Windy conditions. You
are down and slow in very short order.

I find that no flaps are dangerous. That is one way to get a Bo to
float and it leaves you at the mercy of the cross winds far longer
than normal. With no flaps the Deb uses a *lot* of runway.


2. short field

Slower yet, steep with lots of power, land on the mains, let the nose
down, get on the brakes, and then full up elevator to put pressure on
the mains.

3. soft field

Slow with power, nose high, and taxi with the weight off the nose
gear.

4. windshear conditions

Yes (half the gust component)

5. airframe ice

Double yes

6. landing into the setting sun, where you fly a very flat approach and
feel the for runway.

I fly these the same as any other landing other than looking out the
side rather than into the sun. I use my peripheral vision to judge
height.

7. probably a few conditions that I missed.

Yes, you can make three-point squeakers, but not all the time!

Three point squeakers are hard on the nose gear. Nose gear is
expensive, fragile, and for steering once you are too slow to keep it
in the air. Main gear is rugged for landing.

According to the Air Safety Foundation and American Bonanza Society,
most Bo pilots land far faster than necessary.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Roger wrote:

According to the Air Safety Foundation and American Bonanza Society,
most Bo pilots land far faster than necessary.

That was certainly true of the previous owner of my V35B. I received quite
a tongue-lashing from him one dual flight when the stall warning went off
just as the mains touched down during my landing.

He always crossed over the fence at 90 to 100 kts and always lifted off the
runway at 80 kts. Anything less he believed was stall and fall territory.

--
Peter
























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Actually a max performance short field landing can be a greaser....I have
done it...once.

Mike
MU-2



"Bob Gardner" wrote in message
...
Be happy. You only get a greaser if you are a tad too fast. A max
efficiency landing is a plunker, and if there is any water on the runway
it is just what the doctor ordered.

Bob Gardner

"Steve" wrote in message
...
Back in the training days of my PPL I had the bad habit of landing with a
some throttle still in (instead of power idle) and with little pitch
attitude. But the landings were always pretty smooth. Now I do what the
instructor taught me: cut off all power before threshold and raise the
nose
wheel well up in the air during flare. In the final part I get the stall
warning tweet (as the instructor told it should be) and the result is a
somewhat rude main gear contact if the timing of the flare is not
perfect.
Sure the plane stops in very little space (we operate on a 2000 feet
runway), but I get the feeling that I don't do it the right way since
very
seldom I grease it out as I did before. Is just a matter of refining the
technic or am I missing something?

If we did it perfectly, we wouldn't have an excuse to go try again,
would we?
--
Gene Seibel
Tales of Flight - http://pad39a.com/gene/tales.html
Because I fly, I envy no one.