9/11 Standard Operating Procedures

Dave Stadt wrote:

"Newps" wrote in message
. ..


Doug wrote:

Well...... there was a guy handproping his Aeronca. It started and got
away from him with a full throttle. Plane took off, flew around till it
ran out of gas. They found it undamaged and upright on some farmers
field.

Never happened.


But it did happen to the guy in a Cherokee that fell asleep.


It was a Commanche and it was totalled after it crash landed. No
airplane has ever taken off and flown for more than a few seconds
without the ending being a hell of a wreck.

Newps wrote:

It was a Commanche and it was totalled after it crash landed. No
airplane has ever taken off and flown for more than a few seconds
without the ending being a hell of a wreck.

I distinctly remember a case of a tail dragger here in central NY back in
the early to mid 1980s where the pilot hopped out after landing to do
something quick and the aircraft, left at a high idle, did take off on its
own, due to the trim being set nose up.

The news account of this incident described the aircraft climbing a bit,
then stalling and regaining lift then climbing some more. This went on for
roughly 45 minutes until the aircraft ran out of fuel and settled in some
trees somewhere in the south of the Adirondack State park.

Knowing you will scream "bull****" to this as well, I am trying to find a
source other than my memory of the news account to prove this and am in the
process of searching.


--
Peter

On 2006-02-22, EagleEye wrote:
First of all, the post was an article from an aeronautics engineer and
pilot authorized to fly the "heavies"

What country is this pilot certificated to fly heavies in? Is he
licensed by the FAA?

--
Dylan Smith, Port St Mary, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net

Peter R. wrote:

Knowing you will scream "bull****" to this as well, I am trying to find a
source other than my memory of the news account to prove this and am in the
process of searching.


If it ever really happened or not is one thing...

I can't understand why a simple airplane _couldn't_ take off and fly
itself if properly trimmed and the open space were available. Models do
it all the time, using the same rules of physics. Any inherently stable
design will self-correct in flight.

Any of us who have trimmed small aircraft to fly themselves off the
runway should be able to see this as well.

A full-scale aircraft landing itself is a whole 'nuther day... G

On 2006-02-22, Newps wrote:
It was a Commanche and it was totalled after it crash landed. No
airplane has ever taken off and flown for more than a few seconds
without the ending being a hell of a wreck.

There was a pilotless small tailwheel aircraft in Illinois that got away
from the person hand-propping it, then went on to fly a couple of hours
(pilotless) before landing in a field in what looked like a passable
forced landing (the aircraft was damaged, but not a 'hell of a wreck').

Unfortunately I can't find the magic incantations to bring up the NTSB
report - the details I remember is that the plane climbed to over 12000
feet and a police aircraft followed it for a while.

--
Dylan Smith, Port St Mary, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Oolite-Linux: an Elite tribute: http://oolite-linux.berlios.de
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net

In article ,
Immanuel Goldstein wrote:

On 02/22/2006 02:25 AM, BDK wrote:
In article .com,
says...

The Impossibility of Flying Heavy Aircraft Without Training
is the same as flying any aircraft without training.
That's why we do hours in training aircraft, get PPLs and build hours
until we can do CPLs and instrument ratings and so on...
I'm crossposting this to an aviation group so you and your silly
claims can get laughed at over there


Hell, these clowns don't seem to understand just about anyone, and I
mean anyone can fly a plane. It's the takeoffs, navigation, and
especially the landings that are the difficult parts.


Who was flying the planes?

The hijacker were flying the planes, after they murdered the crew, you
fool!

All they had to do was, effectively, steer the plane -- the day was
"severe clear" over the whole East Coast, with 100+ miles visibility.

All the hard stuff -- takeoff, trim for cruise, etc. had already been
done.

All they needed to do was to steer in the general direction of the
targets, until they saw them. It was a simple matter to dive at the WTC,
once they saw it from 20-30 miles away.

In article .com,
"EagleEye" wrote:

Did you actually READ the article George, and did you crosspost it over
to the aviation group? The whole thing, including the interview?

Now what do you think ?
Supposing of course that you can.
You have made the claim that the mad muslims couldn't possibly have
flown the 9/11 suicides.
You are wrong and now you'll be able to explain to pilots as to how you
came to 'know' all about flying....

First of all, the post was an article from an aeronautics engineer and
pilot authorized to fly the "heavies", and so I myself was claiming
nothing, and secondly not only didn't you copy over the article itself
so these poor pilots would know just what the hell we were talking
about, you intentionally removed from the header all the newsgroups to
whom the thread was initially directed and redirected the thread to the
two groups rec.aviation.piloting, alt.conspiracy. Now why would you do
that? What are you hiding george? Loods like a desperate measure on
your part.

I read the whole article and found it severely lacking. Whether or not
he is an aeronautical engineer is irrelevant. I am an aerunautical
engineer and have worked with others whose aeronautical knowledge varied
from abysmal to outstanding. I have also been flying for 45 years and
can separate the loons from the geese.

This guy is a fraud -- his use of the term "pilotage" gives him away as
having no aeronautical knowledge -- not even a student pilot.

Peter R. wrote:

Newps wrote:


It was a Commanche and it was totalled after it crash landed. No
airplane has ever taken off and flown for more than a few seconds
without the ending being a hell of a wreck.


I distinctly remember a case of a tail dragger here in central NY back in
the early to mid 1980s where the pilot hopped out after landing to do
something quick and the aircraft, left at a high idle, did take off on its
own, due to the trim being set nose up.

The news account of this incident described the aircraft climbing a bit,
then stalling and regaining lift then climbing some more. This went on for
roughly 45 minutes until the aircraft ran out of fuel and settled in some
trees somewhere in the south of the Adirondack State park.

Knowing you will scream "bull****" to this as well, I am trying to find a
source other than my memory of the news account to prove this and am in the
process of searching.

I knew about the Commanche because a magazine like Plane and Pilot or
Private Pilot did an article on it a few years ago. There was an exhaust
leak into the cabin and the guy passed out due to CO poisoning. They
showed the picture of the plane on the ground after the crash. There
was a Bonanza that this happened to about 75 miles SW of here about 5
years ago.

Immanuel Goldstein wrote:

On 02/22/2006 02:25 AM, BDK wrote:

In article .com,
says...


The Impossibility of Flying Heavy Aircraft Without Training

is the same as flying any aircraft without training.
That's why we do hours in training aircraft, get PPLs and build hours
until we can do CPLs and instrument ratings and so on...
I'm crossposting this to an aviation group so you and your silly
claims can get laughed at over there


Hell, these clowns don't seem to understand just about anyone, and I
mean anyone can fly a plane. It's the takeoffs, navigation, and
especially the landings that are the difficult parts.


Who was flying the planes?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1559151.stm

Waleed and Wail al-Shehri's father says he didn't hear from his sons for
months prior to 9/11 and their brother has said they are both dead.
The person the BBC referenced is named Walid al-Shri, not Waleed M.
al-Shehri.

The Abdulaziz Al Omari cited in the BBC report is not the same person as
the Abdulaziz Al Omari who was a 9/11 hijacker. The FBI gave the wrong
personal information on the hijacker, but the picture and name were correct.

Saeed Al-ghamdi is a similar situation to Al Omari. The full name of the
person in the BBC report is Saleh Saeed Al-ghamdi. The hijacker is
simply Saeed Al-ghamdi.

There is no evidence that Khalid Al Midhar is alive.

"EagleEye" wrote in message
oups.com...
Did you actually READ the article George, and did you crosspost it over
to the aviation group? The whole thing, including the interview?

Now what do you think ?
Supposing of course that you can.
You have made the claim that the mad muslims couldn't possibly have
flown the 9/11 suicides.
You are wrong and now you'll be able to explain to pilots as to how you
came to 'know' all about flying....

First of all, the post was an article from an aeronautics engineer and
pilot authorized to fly the "heavies", and so I myself was claiming
nothing, and secondly not only didn't you copy over the article itself
so these poor pilots would know just what the hell we were talking
about, you intentionally removed from the header all the newsgroups to
whom the thread was initially directed and redirected the thread to the
two groups rec.aviation.piloting, alt.conspiracy. Now why would you do
that? What are you hiding george? Loods like a desperate measure on
your part.

George is Gay.