My B17 Ride ... A Somewhat Brief Report

Sorry for the delay in spitting this out...

So, last Tuesday (4/18) I flew down to Tucson International to go for a hop
aboard the Collings Foundation B17G "Nine O Nine." Also on hand were their
B24 "Witchcraft" (Formerly "A Dragon and His Tail") and their B25
"Tondelayo." The Collings Foundation is billing the tour as the Wings Of
Freedom tour.

It was a thrill (and a first for me) to just "chock n chain", then walk over
to where the CF planes were parked. I think I caught a few people off guard
because I was almost immediately approached by a CF volunteer wanting to
know what I was doing wandering around on the ramp. I explained that I had
just flown in, had just tied down a C172 and was scheduled to go for a ride
on the B17. He seemed satisfied with my answer but couldn't help letting
slip a little invective regarding Tucson's security (or lack thereof) as
they'd already had to chase several people off the ramp since arriving the
day before. Thereafter I made darn sure I had my plane keys handy whenever
I needed to go back to the plane to make a lens change or to drop off a
jacket.

My flight was scheduled for 0930 but I'd say 95% of the people riding that
day were there by 0800 so they could get a chance to just look over the
historic aircraft. Near as I could tell, I was the youngest person going
for a flight that day. There were many former USAF and USAAF guys there as
well as some retired USMC and USN types. Some were very excited and
animated with much pointing, gesturing and explaining to their
wives/sons/grandsons. Others were very quiet and reserved almost like they
were waiting to say hello to someone they hadn't seen for many, many years.
There were also a small handfull for whom this was their umpteenth flight
aboard these planes.

One moment in particular will stay with me for quite a while. There was one
older gentleman who produced a faded little cardboard box. From this box,
he shook out about six fragments of metal that were probably three to five
inches in length but were very dense and heavy. Instantly, from other
graybeard former USAAF guys gathered around came low whistles and eyebrows
raised in recognition. I didn't know what to make of it until it was
explained that these were fragments of flak from German 88s. They had been
recovered from various parts of *his* B17 during missions back in the
1940's.

The silence was broken by the sound of radial engines coughing and
sputtering to life and suddenly it was time for the first group of
passengers to load up in their chosen mounts and hit the sky. For those of
us scheduled on later flights, it was a great photo op as each plane
lumbered out to the runway and took off to the east. It was also the time
for our group to get our quickee briefing. Please, no more than three
people in the nose at one time. No, the tail gun area is not open and
neither is the ball turret but every other space is fair game. Please do
not lean on the hatch under the flight deck, it won't support weight very
well. Have fun...

The F16s of the AZ ANG were doing their thing so we had some entertainment
while waiting for the CF birds to return and it wasn't too long before
someone picked them up on the horizon as they entered the pattern for
landing.

Once they were stopped on the ramp (but with engines still turning...) it
was time for my group to clamber onboard Nine O Nine for our flight. Some
observations about being aboard a B17:

- Even at idle, the prop blast will make you instinctivly reach up and hold
on to your hat.

- The crew door on the right rear of the fuselage is smaller than you think
and is higher off the ground than it looks. The trick of reaching in
crosshanded and doing a reverse 180 pullup in through the hatch is great in
theory but will make you look awkward in practice.

- My "crew position" for takeoff and landing was seated on the floor behind
and below the copilot facing aft directly under the upper turret. You are
very much alone with your thoughts at this point since you can't really see
anything and you're pretty isolated by noise too.

- I was expecting a bouncy, stiff-legged ride during taxi but B17s taxi
really smoothly.

- Acceleration was quite brisk (I got a pretty good gut-full of web belt
when they came up on the power) and our ground roll seemed to be relatively
short.

- Once I stood up and looked out each side window, the arc of the inboard
props was really, really, close!!! The engines and props seemed to be
living things. You could see the blades change pitch, see the blur of the
props change with RPM adjustments and you could see small amounts of fluid
finding little nooks and crannies from which to seep.

- Combine small, cramped spaces, sharp metal corners and desert thermal chop
and you end up with lots of bruises. One in particular, from when my right
forearm met a vertical piece of the upper turret structure, is still barking
at me. I think I nailed both knees and a shin too. Another thing that I
came away with were very sore leg muscles. You spend a great deal of time
trying to stay upright by shifing your balance constantly (think, running on
the beach...)

- The view from the nose is simply stunning. I could and would have made
the entire flight up there if they'd have let me. I thought of my late Dad
who, at the end of WWII, hitched a ride from Italy to England and flew most
of the way in the nose compartment of a B17. As he was infantry, I'm sure
he was as enamored with the view as I was.

- The view out the roof hatch in the radio compartment is a very close
second. I got a good photo out this hatch but in hindsight, I probably
shouldn't have risked my camera in doing so.

- Migrating back to the waistgunners positions, bouncing off people and
things the entire way, I tried to picture the men who'd fought aboard these
planes. I tried to imagine that the thermal chop was actually our pilot
dodging flak. Scared to death, freezing at FL 250, flak and fighters trying
to destroy you...how hard it must have been to not only first spot an enemy
plane but then try to shoot it down...I could barely keep my feet under me.
These may have been ordinary men but they did very extraordinary things.

Eventually we got the signal to strap in so it was back to my station behind
the copilot for landing. And the landing was a grade A+ greaser.

Once stopped, we were given the signal to unstrap and all I could do was
flash a quick thumbs up to the pilot, mouth the words Thank You to the crew
cheif and it was back to the back and out the hatch...end of ride.

Later, after completing one more cycle of rides by the B17 and the B25, and
they'd established their perimeter on the ramp, all present were allowed to
get up close and personal with all three aircraft. Too soon, I had to slip
back over to my little C172 and get my clearance to depart.

Airborne and headed home, I thought of my Dad and what he and his generation
endured allowing me the freedom to commit aviation. I also thought of the
man I'd met that morning; the man who'd saved those flak fragments for so
many years...and I silently thanked him.

Regards,

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

Photos of my flight can be found at:
www.pbase.com/flyingphotog/b17_ride

( that reads as b17_ride )

Some great pictures, thanks Jay.
shywon

"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:J%F2g.4$KB.0@fed1read08...
Sorry for the delay in spitting this out...

So, last Tuesday (4/18) I flew down to Tucson International to go for a
hop aboard the Collings Foundation B17G "Nine O Nine." Also on hand were
their B24 "Witchcraft" (Formerly "A Dragon and His Tail") and their B25
"Tondelayo." The Collings Foundation is billing the tour as the Wings Of
Freedom tour.

It was a thrill (and a first for me) to just "chock n chain", then walk
over to where the CF planes were parked. I think I caught a few people
off guard because I was almost immediately approached by a CF volunteer
wanting to know what I was doing wandering around on the ramp. I
explained that I had just flown in, had just tied down a C172 and was
scheduled to go for a ride on the B17. He seemed satisfied with my answer
but couldn't help letting slip a little invective regarding Tucson's
security (or lack thereof) as they'd already had to chase several people
off the ramp since arriving the day before. Thereafter I made darn sure I
had my plane keys handy whenever I needed to go back to the plane to make
a lens change or to drop off a jacket.

My flight was scheduled for 0930 but I'd say 95% of the people riding that
day were there by 0800 so they could get a chance to just look over the
historic aircraft. Near as I could tell, I was the youngest person going
for a flight that day. There were many former USAF and USAAF guys there
as well as some retired USMC and USN types. Some were very excited and
animated with much pointing, gesturing and explaining to their
wives/sons/grandsons. Others were very quiet and reserved almost like
they were waiting to say hello to someone they hadn't seen for many, many
years. There were also a small handfull for whom this was their umpteenth
flight aboard these planes.

One moment in particular will stay with me for quite a while. There was
one older gentleman who produced a faded little cardboard box. From this
box, he shook out about six fragments of metal that were probably three to
five inches in length but were very dense and heavy. Instantly, from
other graybeard former USAAF guys gathered around came low whistles and
eyebrows raised in recognition. I didn't know what to make of it until it
was explained that these were fragments of flak from German 88s. They had
been recovered from various parts of *his* B17 during missions back in the
1940's.

The silence was broken by the sound of radial engines coughing and
sputtering to life and suddenly it was time for the first group of
passengers to load up in their chosen mounts and hit the sky. For those
of us scheduled on later flights, it was a great photo op as each plane
lumbered out to the runway and took off to the east. It was also the time
for our group to get our quickee briefing. Please, no more than three
people in the nose at one time. No, the tail gun area is not open and
neither is the ball turret but every other space is fair game. Please do
not lean on the hatch under the flight deck, it won't support weight very
well. Have fun...

The F16s of the AZ ANG were doing their thing so we had some entertainment
while waiting for the CF birds to return and it wasn't too long before
someone picked them up on the horizon as they entered the pattern for
landing.

Once they were stopped on the ramp (but with engines still turning...) it
was time for my group to clamber onboard Nine O Nine for our flight. Some
observations about being aboard a B17:

- Even at idle, the prop blast will make you instinctivly reach up and
hold on to your hat.

- The crew door on the right rear of the fuselage is smaller than you
think and is higher off the ground than it looks. The trick of reaching
in crosshanded and doing a reverse 180 pullup in through the hatch is
great in theory but will make you look awkward in practice.

- My "crew position" for takeoff and landing was seated on the floor
behind and below the copilot facing aft directly under the upper turret.
You are very much alone with your thoughts at this point since you can't
really see anything and you're pretty isolated by noise too.

- I was expecting a bouncy, stiff-legged ride during taxi but B17s taxi
really smoothly.

- Acceleration was quite brisk (I got a pretty good gut-full of web belt
when they came up on the power) and our ground roll seemed to be
relatively short.

- Once I stood up and looked out each side window, the arc of the inboard
props was really, really, close!!! The engines and props seemed to be
living things. You could see the blades change pitch, see the blur of the
props change with RPM adjustments and you could see small amounts of fluid
finding little nooks and crannies from which to seep.

- Combine small, cramped spaces, sharp metal corners and desert thermal
chop and you end up with lots of bruises. One in particular, from when my
right forearm met a vertical piece of the upper turret structure, is still
barking at me. I think I nailed both knees and a shin too. Another thing
that I came away with were very sore leg muscles. You spend a great deal
of time trying to stay upright by shifing your balance constantly (think,
running on the beach...)

- The view from the nose is simply stunning. I could and would have made
the entire flight up there if they'd have let me. I thought of my late
Dad who, at the end of WWII, hitched a ride from Italy to England and flew
most of the way in the nose compartment of a B17. As he was infantry, I'm
sure he was as enamored with the view as I was.

- The view out the roof hatch in the radio compartment is a very close
second. I got a good photo out this hatch but in hindsight, I probably
shouldn't have risked my camera in doing so.

- Migrating back to the waistgunners positions, bouncing off people and
things the entire way, I tried to picture the men who'd fought aboard
these planes. I tried to imagine that the thermal chop was actually our
pilot dodging flak. Scared to death, freezing at FL 250, flak and
fighters trying to destroy you...how hard it must have been to not only
first spot an enemy plane but then try to shoot it down...I could barely
keep my feet under me. These may have been ordinary men but they did very
extraordinary things.

Eventually we got the signal to strap in so it was back to my station
behind the copilot for landing. And the landing was a grade A+ greaser.

Once stopped, we were given the signal to unstrap and all I could do was
flash a quick thumbs up to the pilot, mouth the words Thank You to the
crew cheif and it was back to the back and out the hatch...end of ride.

Later, after completing one more cycle of rides by the B17 and the B25,
and they'd established their perimeter on the ramp, all present were
allowed to get up close and personal with all three aircraft. Too soon, I
had to slip back over to my little C172 and get my clearance to depart.

Airborne and headed home, I thought of my Dad and what he and his
generation endured allowing me the freedom to commit aviation. I also
thought of the man I'd met that morning; the man who'd saved those flak
fragments for so many years...and I silently thanked him.

Regards,

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

Photos of my flight can be found at:
www.pbase.com/flyingphotog/b17_ride

( that reads as b17_ride )

"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:J%F2g.4$KB.0@fed1read08...
Sorry for the delay in spitting this out...

So, last Tuesday (4/18) I flew down to Tucson International to go for a
hop aboard the Collings Foundation B17G "Nine O Nine." Also on hand were
their B24 "Witchcraft" (Formerly "A Dragon and His Tail") and their B25
"Tondelayo." The Collings Foundation is billing the tour as the Wings Of
Freedom tour.


snip

Photos of my flight can be found at:
www.pbase.com/flyingphotog/b17_ride

( that reads as b17_ride )



Yeah Jay.... Thanks for the pics! I love B-17's and would love to take a
ride someday...




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"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:J%F2g.4$KB.0@fed1read08...
Sorry for the delay in spitting this out...

snip

There is something surreal about seeing a moving map GPS in the instrument
cluster!!

Great pictures, thanks....

- Combine small, cramped spaces, sharp metal corners and desert thermal chop
and you end up with lots of bruises. One in particular, from when my right
forearm met a vertical piece of the upper turret structure, is still barking
at me. I think I nailed both knees and a shin too. Another thing that I
came away with were very sore leg muscles. You spend a great deal of time
trying to stay upright by shifing your balance constantly (think, running on
the beach...)

My wife and I flew aboard the same plane for our 25th anniversary.
Experienced all the same things you did. Same thing with the chop. I
had trouble walking for a week from sore legs. Was weightless numerous
times and sailed head first into a machine gun on it's mount. Got a
nasty (and envious) cut on the forehead with blood running down my
face. I can honestly now say that I was wounded by a machine gun while
on a B-17 mission (no one has to know it was from the "non-business"
end). I captured most of it on tape. Had the camera running almost
constant. Had the good fortune of coming into the pattern (and
alongside) a C-47 on that ride and filmed that also.

Jim in CT

Great writeup Jay. I'm glad you had the chance to take a ride. Flying
in was an added bonus and, IMHO, the best way to arrive at such an
event. Very cool


--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-Instrument Airplane
Arrow N2104T

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
you will always long to return"
- Leonardo Da Vinci

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

Airborne and headed home, I thought of my Dad and what he and his generation
endured allowing me the freedom to commit aviation. I also thought of the
man I'd met that morning; the man who'd saved those flak fragments for so
many years...and I silently thanked him.

Great write-up and pix, Jay. Thanks for sharing all of it...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Beckman" wrote in message
news:J%F2g.4$KB.0@fed1read08...

- The crew door on the right rear of the fuselage is smaller than you
think and is higher off the ground than it looks. The trick of reaching
in crosshanded and doing a reverse 180 pullup in through the hatch is
great in theory but will make you look awkward in practice.

That's for the front hatch. Hands up, reversed, grasping the metal at the
top of the hatch. Feet up and inside on either side of the door and use
your feet and hips to pull yourself in.

Being able to enter the bird the old-fashioned way always delighted the vets
that came out to visit ol' 7th Wonder.

-c

"gatt" wrote

Being able to enter the bird the old-fashioned way always delighted the
vets that came out to visit ol' 7th Wonder.

You know, I didn't think it was all that hard, but I guess I'm just a
monkey, from being a carpenter, and climbing around in the rafters all of
the time.
--
Jim in NC

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

Being able to enter the bird the old-fashioned way always delighted the
vets that came out to visit ol' 7th Wonder.

You know, I didn't think it was all that hard, but I guess I'm just a
monkey, from being a carpenter, and climbing around in the rafters all of
the time.

Not as hard as it is unnerving the first time you try. If your fingers slip
it's a long headfirst-fall to the tarmac, which is one thing, but you'll
miss whatever opportunity you had with the B-17, which is the worst of all.
:

It must have been quite a bit more of a challenge doing it with full gear,
though. I got to crawl out of the tailgunner's escape hatch several years
ago at PDX in a genuine escape. That's a video I would put on the internet
but it would embarrass the pilots and the organization. Since it was a
non-public flight, I got to crawl back and buckle in to the tailgunner's
bicycle seat for landing. That was obviously amusing...twin-.50s in the
pattern at an international airport. But the tower cleared an commuter
jet to depart on 28L and we were already over the fence landing on the
perpendicular, 21. I had no idea about any of this but suddenly the
airplane throttled up again, we started accelerating like we were doing a
go-around. As soon as we crossed the perpendicular, the engines dropped and
we began to decelerate rapidly (keep in mind I'm belted in, but crouched on
my knees facing backward.)

All of a sudden, there's a hideous noise, my head smacks against the left
side of the tailgunner's window and the tail starts coming around clockwise.
There's smoke outside coming from my right, which is the left side of the
plane. Then she yaws around the other way, and the tail began filling up
with smoke and the smell of burning rubber. I said something to my
grandfather (he'd been gone for two or three years) and then suddenly the
old bird settled down like nothing had happened.

In front of the hangar, there were three hatches open within seconds of the
props stopping. The tail was still filled with acrid rubber smoke, so I
just opened the tail, flung my feet out and thought "Doesn't this beat all!"

The pilot, whose name I won't mention, is the VP of the company and flies
747s. There wasn't a volunteer on board who didn't shake his hand
afterward. He seemed like he'd just pulled out of a near-collision and/or
ground loop in a four-engine bomber, but he walked it off calmly and then
explained that one of the brakes had seized up and, fortunately, broken free
a moment after but the resulting correction. I didn't see the copilot
afterward; I think he was already on the phone with the tower chewing ass.
In any case, I called my dad and told him I'd just bailed out of a smoking
B-17. It was a low bailout--3 feet-- no time for a parachute to open but
miraculously I lived.

-c