Any traffic please advise

Newps wrote:


They don't seem to like an
instant "negative contact", and they really hate no response or a slow
response.



That's a pretty fine line, don'tcha think?

Possibly.

As for no and very slow response, if you're on the frequency, it means
you asked for advisories, flight following, or are on an IFR plan. I
don't see the problem with ATC expecting you to be listening to them and
prepared to respond promptly to a call. If you aren't going to pay
attention, perhaps you don't really want or need the services and should
simply squawk 1200.

"Jim Burns" wrote in message
...

That's what I thought until I got spanked.


You were right. The controller was out of line.

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:02:08 -0400, Jonathan Goodish
wrote in
:

Responding with "looking" acknowledges the transmission and tells
the controller than I don't have the traffic but I'm not blowing it off.

I agree with your reasoning, but regulations only instruct the
controller to provide the VFR traffic advisory; they don't require the
controller to be concerned if you see the traffic or not. That said,
it has been my experience, that a controller will make an effort to
continue advising the traffic's position (if it is a factor) until the
pilot reports "in sight."

On 25 Aug 2006 10:02:17 -0700, "Robert M. Gary"
wrote in . com:


Jose wrote:

You should be listening on the frequency for long enough that such
students have made several such turns before you are close enough for
that to matter. Make your own position report. That should be enough
of a prompt for pilots in the area to respond if warranted.

That's hard for IFR pilots who often get dumped onto airports as close
as 10 miles out. In my plane I'm usually approaching at 170 knots
ground speed. Not much time to wait for the next transmission. If the
freq is busy I agree with you, however, if the freq is dead it can be
helpful.


Yet, ten miles is what the AIM recommends:

http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/AIM/Chap4/aim0401.html#4-1-9
4-1-9(c) Recommended Traffic Advisory Practices

1. Pilots of inbound traffic should monitor and communicate as
appropriate on the designated CTAF from 10 miles to landing.
Pilots of departing aircraft should monitor/communicate on the
appropriate frequency from start-up, during taxi, and until 10
miles from the airport unless the CFRs or local procedures require
otherwise.

2. Pilots of aircraft conducting other than arriving or departing
operations at altitudes normally used by arriving and departing
aircraft should monitor/communicate on the appropriate frequency
while within 10 miles of the airport unless required to do
otherwise by the CFRs or local procedures. Such operations include
parachute jumping/dropping, en route, practicing maneuvers, etc.

On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 13:31:31 -0400, TxSrv wrote in
:

The next thing the Feds need to make verboten is folks who
fire up and broadcast over CTAF that they're going to taxi
from their parking spot over to the active runway (what possible
purpose could that information / transmission serve?).


Except it's in Advisory Circular 90-42F (re nontowered field
communications) as a suggested announcement.

I knew I'd seen Self Announce taxi intentions someplace befo

http://www.avweb.com/other/ac90-42f.html
6. RECOMMENDED TRAFFIC ADVISORY PRACTICES.

All inbound traffic should continuously monitor and communicate,
as appropriate, on the designated CTAF from a point 10 miles from
the airport until clear of the movement area. Departing aircraft
should continuously monitor/communicate on the appropriate
frequency from startup, during taxi, and until 10 miles from the
airport unless the Federal Aviation Regulations or local
procedures require otherwise.

11. EXAMPLES OF SELF-ANNOUNCE PHRASEOLOGIES.

2) Outbound:

STRAWN TRAFFIC, QUEENAIRE SEVEN ONE FIVE FIVE BRAVO (LOCATION ON
AIRPORT) TAXIING TO RUNWAY TWO SIX STRAWN.


12. SUMMARY OF RECOMMENDED COMMUNICATIONS PROCEDURES.

e. Facility at Airport: Tower or FSS not in Operation
Frequency Use: Self-announced on CTAF
Communication/Broadcast Procedures: See Below.

Communication/Broadcast Procedures:

Outbound: Before taxiing and before taxiing on the runway for
departure.

Inbound: 10 miles out, and entering downwind, base, and final, and
leaving the runway.

Practice Instrument Approach: Departing final approach fix (name)
inbound, and approach completed/terminated.

B A R R Y wrote:
Robert M. Gary wrote:

Did you make a position report entering the airport environment, for
instance as you entered the 45?

Did the student already in the pattern understand that my transmission
meant he should say something back to me? Again, it comes down to freq
congestion. If the freq is dead then its good to be verbose and
communicate in long form. Most of us do the same with ATC. Its the
difference between, "Good morning Oakland Center Mooney 1234A with you
passing through 10 thousand for 15 thousand....." vs. "1234A through 10
thousand".

-Robert

Seems like just about everyone hates ATPA trasmissions...but how did
they get their start? I've heard it was around the PATCO strike, but I
wasn't flying back then. Anyone know?

If the freq is dead then its good to be verbose and
communicate in long form.

The freq may be dead near you, but not dead elsewhere, and your verbose
transmission may impact others you can't hear.

True, if you can talk to them, you probably can hear them, but that's
not always the case.

Jose
--
The monkey turns the crank and thinks he's making the music.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jim Burns" wrote in message
...
One of my all time pet peeves.
I've even heard it transformed into "Any other traffic, please watch out"
Jim

My best one I have heard was some knucklehead who asked "any traffic in the
area say intentions." I did exactly what he asked.

wrote:

At a safety seminar, a controller explained that "with you" indicates
that you're being handed off. He said never use "with you" on a first
call, as that makes the controller look for your information, which he
doesn't have.

Was he really a controller, or just did he just sleep at a Holiday Inn?

Why use "with you" at all? It's a useless waste of air.

"Looking" is another one that is used frequently here at our Class D
airport. Why is that wrong?

It is not proper phraseology and is nearly as useless as "with you."

The correct responses are "negative contact" or "traffic in sight."

It indicates that the person heard the
advisory and is looking but doesn't yet see the traffic, it's clear,
concise, and brief. ?

And wrong.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM