RVSM from Cabin Class

We flew commercial back to Atlanta yesterday from California after a
weeklong trip to San Francisco, Napa, and Yosemite. On the way home, I had
a window seat and was surprised on a couple of occasions at how close 1,000'
of vertical separation appears when you're looking out the window from seat
13A. When another airliner passes 1,000' right under you on a reciprocal
heading with a closing speed of over 1,000 mph, it looks CLOSE.

Other than being startled a couple of times by close views of other
airliners, the flight was really nice. We saw the painted desert, Meteor
Crater, and got a distant view of the Grand Canyon among other things.

One more comment. We had a connecting flight through LAX and had to catch a
bus from one terminal to another. At LAX the inter-terminal busses run
around on the ramp with all of the other service vehicles. There is a LOT of
traffic on that ramp, which really surprised me!

Kyle Boatright writes:

We flew commercial back to Atlanta yesterday from California after a
weeklong trip to San Francisco, Napa, and Yosemite. On the way home, I had
a window seat and was surprised on a couple of occasions at how close 1,000'
of vertical separation appears when you're looking out the window from seat
13A. When another airliner passes 1,000' right under you on a reciprocal
heading with a closing speed of over 1,000 mph, it looks CLOSE.

It IS close. Compare 1000 feet with the actual dimensions of the
airliner, which are an appreciable fraction of the separation distance
for larger aircraft.

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In article ,
Mxsmanic wrote:

Kyle Boatright writes:

We flew commercial back to Atlanta yesterday from California after a
weeklong trip to San Francisco, Napa, and Yosemite. On the way home, I had
a window seat and was surprised on a couple of occasions at how close
1,000'
of vertical separation appears when you're looking out the window from seat
13A. When another airliner passes 1,000' right under you on a reciprocal
heading with a closing speed of over 1,000 mph, it looks CLOSE.

It IS close. Compare 1000 feet with the actual dimensions of the
airliner, which are an appreciable fraction of the separation distance
for larger aircraft.

And when you are flying 500 feet above CBAS ceiling and Approach is
vectoring inbound heavies 500 feet over your head, they look REAL BIG!!!

How tall is the airliner.. with the gear retracted.. lower engine cowls to
top of rudder..
150ft ft? 200ft?
Odds of getting "perfectly" over/under each other is marginal, so add the
slant range distance.
Plus allowable altimeter errors.

1000ft is pleanty of room.

BT

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
Kyle Boatright writes:

We flew commercial back to Atlanta yesterday from California after a
weeklong trip to San Francisco, Napa, and Yosemite. On the way home, I
had
a window seat and was surprised on a couple of occasions at how close
1,000'
of vertical separation appears when you're looking out the window from
seat
13A. When another airliner passes 1,000' right under you on a reciprocal
heading with a closing speed of over 1,000 mph, it looks CLOSE.

It IS close. Compare 1000 feet with the actual dimensions of the
airliner, which are an appreciable fraction of the separation distance
for larger aircraft.

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BT writes:

How tall is the airliner.. with the gear retracted.. lower engine cowls to
top of rudder..
150ft ft? 200ft?

Even with gear extended, a 747-400 is 63 feet high--about 1/16 of the
separation distance. That's very roughly the relationship of one inch
to one foot, if you want to visualize it.

1000ft is pleanty of room.

I don't know that it's plenty, but with the right equipment, it's
sufficient.

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"Kyle Boatright" writes:
We flew commercial back to Atlanta yesterday from California after a
weeklong trip to San Francisco, Napa, and Yosemite. On the way home, I had
a window seat and was surprised on a couple of occasions at how close 1,000'
of vertical separation appears when you're looking out the window from seat
13A. When another airliner passes 1,000' right under you on a reciprocal
heading with a closing speed of over 1,000 mph, it looks CLOSE.

I got the chance to sit up front in a plane in the flight levels a few
weeks ago, and it looks really close from the front window too. :-)
Especially dramatic is when you have two planes, one 1000' above you,
and another 1000' below you, passing at almost exactly the same time.
It feels like you are threading a needle between the other two
planes...

Chris

so.. only 63ft tall.. and in your workds 1/16th the distance, so get the
point... 1000ft is pleanty,

And you are not a pilot so how do you know what is sufficient and what is
not.

B

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
BT writes:

How tall is the airliner.. with the gear retracted.. lower engine cowls
to
top of rudder..
150ft ft? 200ft?

Even with gear extended, a 747-400 is 63 feet high--about 1/16 of the
separation distance. That's very roughly the relationship of one inch
to one foot, if you want to visualize it.

1000ft is pleanty of room.

I don't know that it's plenty, but with the right equipment, it's
sufficient.

--
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I got the chance to sit up front in a plane in the flight levels a few
weeks ago, and it looks really close from the front window too. :-)
Especially dramatic is when you have two planes, one 1000' above you,
and another 1000' below you, passing at almost exactly the same time.
It feels like you are threading a needle between the other two
planes...

Chris

When you are at flight levels, due to the curvature of the earth, on first
apperance, the "higher" aircraft may appear to be lower, and as the distance
closes, the appearance is that he climbs from below to above, where he was
all the time.

I will agree that it is "dramatic".

BT

BT writes:

so.. only 63ft tall.. and in your workds 1/16th the distance, so get the
point... 1000ft is pleanty,

And you are not a pilot so how do you know what is sufficient and what is
not.

There's nothing magic about being a pilot, and reasoning ability is
not the sole domain of the licensed pilot.

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ahh... but there is somethign magical about being a pilot... and because you
are not you do not know that.
and as far as reasoning ability? one cannot reason, what one has not
experienced..

I've known a lot of smart people that were just not cut out to be in a
cockpit.

BT

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
...
BT writes:

so.. only 63ft tall.. and in your workds 1/16th the distance, so get the
point... 1000ft is pleanty,

And you are not a pilot so how do you know what is sufficient and what is
not.

There's nothing magic about being a pilot, and reasoning ability is
not the sole domain of the licensed pilot.

--
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