MS Flight Sim As a Training Tool

Gatt this thread and many others lately are here because of posts written by
an idiot named Anthony aka msxmaniac who not only has never flown and
aircraft and has no desire to, thinks that most of us that do fly don't know
what the hell we are talking about because our real world experience doesn't
jive with his playing of MSFS.

Ahem -- not THIS thread. I haven't been reading MX's stuff much,
lately, so if this thread seem to be echoing his thoughts, it's purely
coincidence.

As a pilot with over 1600 hours in the logbook, over the last 12 years,
I think I'm qualified to state that the Kiwi reproduces flight in every
way possible, short of full motion. Until you take a few turns around
the patch in the Kiwi, I don't think you can quite appreciate the level
of realism this thing can produce. With the real world projected in
full scale, and the panel reproduced in actual scale size, real flight
controls, and a lightning-fast computer, it's quite amazing.

I'll be glad to let you fly it for an hour or three, absolutely free,
if you ever get in my neighborhood. (Just don't show up on Tuesday
night -- Movie Night -- or you might have to stand in line... :-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[MSFS] allows me to remember to set and ident freqs, follow the
instruments, time the approach (I use my kneeboard and timer)

How do you set and ident the freqs? Using the mouse on the radio stack
and the OBS is pretty lame, and (at least for FS 2002) I can't find a
better way. So, I just have them preset and fly the approach.

Jose
--
"There are 3 secrets to the perfect landing. Unfortunately, nobody knows
what they are." - (mike).
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

As a pilot with over 1600 hours in the logbook, over the last 12 years,
I think I'm qualified to state that the Kiwi reproduces flight in every
way possible, short of full motion. Until you take a few turns around
the patch in the Kiwi, I don't think you can quite appreciate the level
of realism this thing can produce. With the real world projected in
full scale, and the panel reproduced in actual scale size, real flight
controls, and a lightning-fast computer, it's quite amazing.

Oh, and I forgot to mention the surround-sound system -- with the
subwoofer firmly attached to the bottom of the Kiwi's metal frame.

I've flown a Lockheed Constellation, and I'm here to tell you that the
Connie sim absolutely NAILS the sound of those big four radial
engines...and the vibration you get through your keister in-flight...

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
ups.com...
Gatt this thread and many others lately are here because of posts written
by
an idiot named Anthony aka msxmaniac who not only has never flown and
aircraft and has no desire to, thinks that most of us that do fly don't
know
what the hell we are talking about because our real world experience
doesn't
jive with his playing of MSFS.

Ahem -- not THIS thread. I haven't been reading MX's stuff much,
lately, so if this thread seem to be echoing his thoughts, it's purely
coincidence.

As a pilot with over 1600 hours in the logbook, over the last 12 years,
I think I'm qualified to state that the Kiwi reproduces flight in every
way possible, short of full motion. Until you take a few turns around
the patch in the Kiwi, I don't think you can quite appreciate the level
of realism this thing can produce. With the real world projected in
full scale, and the panel reproduced in actual scale size, real flight
controls, and a lightning-fast computer, it's quite amazing.

I'll be glad to let you fly it for an hour or three, absolutely free,
if you ever get in my neighborhood. (Just don't show up on Tuesday
night -- Movie Night -- or you might have to stand in line... :-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"


Jay I will of course take you up on that... BUT you are letting the big
projection screen and chair fool you into believing the simulation. All that
screen and controls changes nothing in the software itself and that is where
the difference is.

Ask your self this. Would you if it were legal allow your son to be trained
in nothing but the Kiwi and then solo?

In article . com,
"Jay Honeck" wrote:

Basically the only way I will ever convince you is for you to come fly
the damned thing. You'll be amazed, I think.

next time I'm there... but probably not for 3-4 years, at least.

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

In article . com,
"Jay Honeck" wrote:

Can you log it? No, for one the flight models are rubbish.

Actually, I've found this is NOT true. What I *thought* were bad
flight models was actually the computer lagging just a split
millisecond behind my control inputs. It was imperceptible, and
everything *looked* smooth -- but it was obviously there.

When we hooked everything up to a truly world-class computer, the
impact was immediate and everyone noticed it. Suddenly, the "flight
models" were dead-on, because the controls were finally responding in
real time.

Can you do a soft-field take-off with it?

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

"Gig 601XL Builder" wrDOTgiaconaATcox.net wrote in message
...
Ask your self this. Would you if it were legal allow your
son to be trained in nothing but the Kiwi and then solo?


Who has ever advocated flying solo after only sim training? The military
makes extensive use of simulators and even they do not do that. The point
is the sim trained student will probably solo sooner and fly better than the
non-sim student.
http://www.aopa.org/pilot/features/future0004.html?PF

The point is the sim trained student will probably
solo sooner and fly better than the
non-sim student.

Will they have sim-bad habits to unlearn?

Jose
--
"There are 3 secrets to the perfect landing. Unfortunately, nobody knows
what they are." - (mike).
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Ask your self this. Would you if it were legal allow your son to be trained
in nothing but the Kiwi and then solo?

Of course not. That's the motion part of the equation that can't be
reproduced in the Kiwi.

There is also the subtle but very real fact that you can't produce the
fear of death in the Kiwi. Although this sounds sensational and
silly, it's truly not -- since when you're flying a real airplane, your
life (and the lives of your loved ones) are literally in your own
hands.

This is a responsiblity that some may not be able to handle (I've often
wondered if it wasn't fear of this consequence that causes some
post-solo students to drop out of flight training), and you can't
simulate that feeling in any real way.

Still, it's as close as you can get, outside of the real plane. And,
as a training tool, it is therefore terrific.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Gig 601XL Builder writes:

So you're not even knowledgeable on flight simulators.

I seem to know a lot more than many people here, some of whom sound
like they've been out of the loop for many years.

You can't even compare, with any authority, the value of
MSFS against its competitors much less against the flight
characteristics of real aircraft.

MSFS doesn't have any real competitors. X-Plane is interesting but
not as comprehensive as MSFS.

You are just proving to be more useless than even I thought.

Your entire post is a personal attack against me, and doesn't mention
the topic of the thread at all. How useful do you think that is?

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.