If user fees go into effect I'm done

ktbr writes:

Well, if you are going to make a statement like that then you can
also say that commercial air travel isn't really "necessary".

Not really. Commercial air travel is a necessary part of the country's
infrastructure. General aviation is not. If GA disappeared tomorrow,
virtually nothing would perceptibly change in the U.S. If commercial air
travel disappeared, the country would nearly grind to a halt.

Of course we are really only talking about free societies that
encourage business and priviate property rights. Anything else is
the old Soviet Union, in one form or another.

People who are not interested in GA don't see it that way. To them, GA is a
hobby for the rich, and they are justifiably curious as to why they should
subsidize GA in any way, since they receive nothing in return.

--
Transpose mxsmanic and gmail to reach me by e-mail.

"Mxsmanic" wrote

People who are not interested in GA don't see it that way. To them, GA is
a
hobby for the rich, and they are justifiably curious as to why they should
subsidize GA in any way, since they receive nothing in return.

What is your definition of GA?

BDS

"ktbr" wrote in message
...
This is nothing more than a very large tax increase.

or is it just the end of a subsidy by the taxpayer

Mxsmanic wrote:
Gig 601XL Builder writes:

The "hobby" flying that people, including the wealthy, do adds so
little to the cost of maintaining the national airspace system that
it is hardly worth mentioning. The things that get money spent on
them like airports are helping the struggling masses by supporting
businesses that create jobs.

I strongly suspect that GA is more of a burden than an asset for the
population and society at large. Commercial air travel is a
necessity; general aviation is not.

I can think of 3 major companies that together employee ~2500 people in my
town of ~20,000 that would not be here if it weren't for the availability of
GA flight. In fact, the town would probably dry up and blow away if any one
of these left and would certainly do so if any two of them did.

And since one of these companies just decided to pay for the college
education of every single person that graduates from our school system I'd
say that means pretty much everybody here benefits from GA.

"ktbr" wrote in message
...
There truly *should* be some sort of test before one can vote so as
to weed out the both the ignorant and the stupid people.

That would remove the vote from a few posters here then

Mxsmanic wrote:
Even today, with 1/3 of the U.S. population illiterate, there aren't
too many people who are qualified to vote, even though most of them
are allowed to vote.


And where exactly do you get that 1/3 of the US population is illiterate?

The CIA world fact book says...

definition: age 15 and over can read and write
total population: 99%
male: 99%
female: 99% (2003 est.)

But that is the CIA, so I can understant if you say "Bull" to that.

But this link http://www.theglobalist.com/DBWeb/St...x?StoryId=2553 is
written by a guy saying that Cuba is doing a great job and compares the US
to Cuba and even he says 97%.

Mxsmanic wrote:
Gig 601XL Builder writes:

Yes, I'd be willing bet all of us do. Though the other two options,
no insurance or a state run program, are also not my idea of great
ideas either.

So what's the solution?

The following only applies to the US.

Tort reform would help. As it is now if you go to the Doctor with a cold he
is more likly than not to run tests that aren't going to find anything other
than you have a cold because of the off chance that you might have something
else.

Higher deductible are a good thing for a couple of reasons. They make the
insured take more care when they decide to see a doctor. In the US it is not
unusual for people to go to the doctor when they really don't need to
because all it is going to cost them, out of their own pocket at that moment
is $30.00. When they do the first issue comes into play.

A better fix than the higher deductable is a Health Savings Account. It has
all the systemic benefits of the high deductable and really causes people to
take ownership of their health care.

Mxsmanic wrote:

People who are not interested in GA don't see it that way. To them, GA is a
hobby for the rich, and they are justifiably curious as to why they should
subsidize GA in any way, since they receive nothing in return.


They are ignorant. Every day in this country GA is used by businesses
large to small. We have two UPS contract flights in and out of our GA
airport daily and two check hauling flights daily. Business jets come in
and out of here several times a week on business purposes with any of
dozens of business located in this town or nearby. All this is GA, not
Commercial.

Most people have no clue that much of the products that get shipped to
their homes come via GA.

ktbr wrote:

They are ignorant. Every day in this country GA is used by businesses
large to small. We have two UPS contract flights in and out of our GA
airport daily and two check hauling flights daily. Business jets come in
and out of here several times a week on business purposes with any of
dozens of business located in this town or nearby. All this is GA, not
Commercial.

Not quite. Most of it _is_ commercial, but it's not scheduled airline
service, so it's GA. LOTS of GA is commercial in nature. G


Most people have no clue that much of the products that get shipped to
their homes come via GA.

I agree, if you mean products that actually traveled by air.

Chris wrote:

This is nothing more than a very large tax increase.


or is it just the end of a subsidy by the taxpayer



Well if it is, it is one of the few taxpayer subsidies to ever end.

Besides, one way or the other you WILL pay for it, sort of like
increasing taxes on corporations... I wonder what the airlines can
charge to ship a package from point A to B once the competition
of GA is history.