Dizziness disorientation

In article
,
says...


On Jan 17, 8:57 am, Airbus wrote:

Disorientation can be accompanied by coriolis effect, or not. When you
lose visual reference to the horizon, and your physical sensations give
you misleading information about your situation, this is disorientation.

"Coriolis" when used in Aviation refers to the earth's rotational
affect on air masses:



Better research would have rendered you reply so much more convincing . . .

http://www.answers.com/topic/artific...cat=technology

http://www.aopa.org/asf/publications/sa17.pdf

http://www.yorku.ca/harris/pubs/coriolis.pdf

In article ,
says...


On Jan 17, 11:07 pm, Airbus wrote:
In article
,
says...



On Jan 17, 8:57 am, Airbus wrote:

Disorientation can be accompanied by coriolis effect, or not. When you
lose visual reference to the horizon, and your physical sensations give
you misleading information about your situation, this is disorientation.

"Coriolis" when used in Aviation refers to the earth's rotational
affect on air masses:

Better research would have rendered you reply so much more convincing . . .

http://www.answers.com/topic/artific...cat=technology

http://www.aopa.org/asf/publications/sa17.pdf

http://www.yorku.ca/harris/pubs/coriolis.pdf

Thanks for the reminder, however snidely proffered.

You're right - I apologize.
This discussion came up here maybe a year or so ago, and someone who was pretty
well informed used the term. I was tempted to reply in the way you did, but I
checked first, and found out I still had much to learn.

Bertie the Bunyip wrote in
:

Airplanes do not weathervane when they are off the ground in a steady
wind.

Hence the term "prevailing"...

On Jan 16, 8:28*pm, wrote:
*We had one little kid
get motion sick, watching her dad yank and crank.
--
Jay Honeck

Dude.

Mxsmaniac has never felt anything due to the unfortunate circumstance
of him being born without a brain. I suspect Ken is suffering from the
same ailment.

Well, no, Bertie. We landed at Burke Lakefront one winter, wind was
stong enough to weathervane the Mooney on a snowpacked taxiway.


On Jan 17, 10:28*pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Judah wrote 54:



I'm not a guru, but I have experienced weathervaning when flying
"hands off & feet off" in a direction that was 60* or so against the
prevailing wind current.

Airplanes do not weathervane when they are off the ground in a steady wind..

Bertie

Judah wrote in news:Xns9A29CA8A84A5EJudahnospamnet@
209.197.15.254:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote in
:

Airplanes do not weathervane when they are off the ground in a steady
wind.

Hence the term "prevailing"...


Um, that means something a bit more long term to me.


Bertie

Tina wrote in
:

Well, no, Bertie. We landed at Burke Lakefront one winter, wind was
stong enough to weathervane the Mooney on a snowpacked taxiway.


Of course! I've seen it weathervane a lot of airplanes. On the ground.


Bertie

On Jan 17, 10:28*pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Judah wrote

97.15.254:



I'm not a guru, but I have experienced weathervaning when flying
"hands off & feet off" in a direction that was 60* or so against
the prevailing wind current.

Airplanes do not weathervane when they are off the ground in a steady
wind
.

Bertie

I'm not a guru, but I have experienced weathervaning when flying
"hands off & feet off" in a direction that was 60* or so against the
prevailing wind current.

Airplanes do not weathervane when they are off the ground in a steady wind.

Bertie

Mistaking rudder out of trim, maybe, for "weather-vaning" while
embedded in a moving air mass?

I think of our 152s little trim tab. It's adjusted so that you
absolutely have no tendency of the plane to yaw straight and level.

I noticed flying the 172 the other day that it had a tendency to come
off course more.

Is this a rudder trim effect (plenty of aircraft have rudder trim
tabs)?

wrote in
:

I'm not a guru, but I have experienced weathervaning when flying
"hands off & feet off" in a direction that was 60* or so against
the prevailing wind current.

Airplanes do not weathervane when they are off the ground in a steady
wind.

Bertie

Mistaking rudder out of trim, maybe, for "weather-vaning" while
embedded in a moving air mass?

I think of our 152s little trim tab. It's adjusted so that you
absolutely have no tendency of the plane to yaw straight and level.

I noticed flying the 172 the other day that it had a tendency to come
off course more.

Is this a rudder trim effect (plenty of aircraft have rudder trim
tabs)?

Probably he's noticing the drift while enroute and has the whole wind
thing assways in his head. This is pretty common amongst British pilots.
They get told about wind in books but are taught no ground reference
manuevers at all. They can probably regurgitate what they have been told
about wind, but I have found few of them who really understand it, let
alone manuever the airplane anything like instinctually in relation to
wind.
They get told a lot of really useful things that US pilots do not, BTW.
Largely about weather and nav, but aircraft handling is abyssmal.
A lot of old american airplanes have been imported there in recent
years. Luscombes, Champs, cubs, etc. and they are wrecked at a ferocious
rate, partly because of this deficiency in initial training, partly
because of the wild weather and their fondness fo rvery short fields,
and partly because most of them don't get to fly enough because of the
Wx and the horrific costs.
I completely believe the OP, a UK PL meant what he said. I would reckon
his instructor knows only marginally more than that about wind.

Adn don't even get me started on how they aproach stalls!


Bertie

On 18 Jan 2008 03:24:59 GMT, Judah wrote:

New Pilot wrote in news:n9tro39afurstkjapf0rtnc6ppl43not4v@
4ax.com:

Hi folks,

Does anyone have any experience of the following or know about it.

I recently got a ppl licence and generally are fine doing all the
flying type tasks required to safely take off fly and land.
One thing that seems to get me every time is if I am for example
flying straight and level at 2 or 3 thousand feet (height just as an
arbitory figure) and I encounter a crosswind the aircraft slowly but
surely starts to yaw as the wind hits the tail fin. this bit I
understand but the bit I don't is when this situation happens
I feel dizzy and disorientated for a few moments as the view from the
window in VFR starts to rotate.
I can reduce this by a bit of rudder to stop the rotation and keep the
ball in the centre.

Is this normal or should I not be flying?

thanks

I'm not a guru, but I have experienced weathervaning when flying "hands off
& feet off" in a direction that was 60* or so against the prevailing wind
current.

The point about the plane not maintaining coordination is probably about
right - certainly you are not "stepping on the ball" (or perhaps more
likely as a new pilot, stepping on it too much) and causing a skid or slip,
which is probably contributing to your disorientation.

Generally speaking, though, the weathervaning that I have experienced has
caused a turn that was not very quick, but more progressive and subtle. If
you are experiencing an aggressive turn, I have to believe you are not
controlling the rudder properly. Otherwise if you are getting dizzy from a
simple turn at altitude, I would agree with the others here that you should
visit your AME...

I can only remember getting dizzy while flying twice. Once when I did my
first recovery from unusual attitudes under the hood (I had a pretty
aggressive instructor - I think he was doing himmelmans while I was there
with my head pointed at the floor), and once when I had just recovered from
a cold and had a bit of trouble getting my ears to pop on a relatively
aggressive descent - apparently I wasn't as recovered as I thought I was,
and when my ears finally did pop, my whole head whooshed for a second.

You should not be experiencing dizziness on a regular basis during normal
straight-and-level flight nor even in a relatively aggressive turn. Do you
have trouble doing short approaches or steep turns?


The turning effect seems to happen over about 8 to 10 seconds to turn
the aircraft 15 degrees.
Once turned it seems to remain stable now pointing in a different
direction. I then see that the balance ball is a little off centre.
I did try turning the ruddder trim knob to the right and left but it
did not seem to have much if any effect.

Steep turns 45 degees or more to the right are fine,
Have some trouble with turns to the left usually kicks in after one
full circuit almost if the fluid in my ears is delayed in some way -
Thogh i fight the sensation and can do satisfactory steep turns to the
left.
maybe having just done a few 45degree turns to the right and then
pretty much banking to the left without stopping at the straight and
level for a rest may not help.

Loosing height quickly is no problem the ears do equalise to the
pressure change - gaining height quickly in a worn PA28 does not
really happen max = 750 feet/minute thats with just me fueled to tabs
and no baggage.