How much longer?

On Apr 11, 12:30*am, Nomen Nescio wrote:

Agreed.
I believe nothing because someone says so.
But, I listen to everything.
Once in a while, I learn something.
Other times, it's a matter of "know your enemy". ie. Bowling for Colombine,
which I've seen in it's entirety. And I certainly wouldn't comment on it until
I actually saw it.
I rented Algore's "propaganda", also, before I felt I could comment on it.

I've also learned that anyone who thinks they know everything about
something they've never seen is probably an idiot and always will be.

The video link I posted offers what I think is a rational hypothesis for
some of the seemingly irrational thinking that has permeated politics,
lately.
Not saying I buy it, but I found it worth considering.

I may be wrong about a lot of things. But, unlike a lot of people, I actually
TRY to be right.


On behalf of everyone on this group, I want to thank you for making
clear just what an exceptional human being you are. You are a shining
example for us all.

Phil

Morgans wrote:

"Dylan Smith" wrote

Technology to make AC from DC, DC from AC, high voltage DC from low
voltage DC and all the combinations has existed for decades. It's very
basic stuff. I've made 1000 volts DC from 12 volts DC. It's not even
hard to do.

Right, not hard; just expensive and inefficient as hell, and in some cases,
almost unusable.

Most of the home level inverters are what they call "modified sine wave"
inverters. All that says is that the innards of the inverter cut the power
on and off rapidly, so if you read the voltage, it rises and falls in a
choppy square notched "sort-a-looks-like-a-sine-wave" if you squint real
hard.

The more sophisticated ones are more than three times the cost, which makes
them very expensive.

The modified sine wave converters will power most stuff without permanent
damage, but don't try to use your DeWalt cordless drill battery charger.
Anything that reads like a high voltage until you put the load on it will
fry, and it says so in the inverter's instructions, if you take the time to
read the fine print. Don't ask me how I know that.

They also put out a good bit of heat, and guess what. That heat is power
going out the window, in a big efficiency loss. Oh, and don't try to power
a refrigerator, or AC, unless you really want to see a big time efficiency
hit. They don't work very well, at all.

So, the long and short is that if you are using battery or Solar DC, you had
better be using as many DC units as at all possible, or your batteries will
not last very darn long.

I'm not against Solar, but everyone needs to know the limitations of doing
so. You need a specially designed system using mostly straight DC, or lots
of money, if you expect to get much useful power out of the system.
--

You do realize that most computer rooms and some entire buildings
have battery backup and huge inverters for power failure protection?

These are true sine wave inverters, are quite efficient, regulated, and
phase synchronized to the grid so switchover is transparent.

However, you are correct about the cheap Chinese junk you get at places
like Pep Boys; they put out crap wave forms, are inefficient, and
seldom have regulated outputs.

And you are correct about the cost; decent inverters cost a lot more
than the junk.

There is no potential technology to lower the cost of such inverters
other than economies of scale, and the installation and maintenance
cost of such inverters is usually ignored by solar energy proponents.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

"Phil J" wrote:


I may be wrong about a lot of things. But, unlike a
lot of people, I actuall TRY to be right.


On behalf of everyone on this group, I want to
thank you for making clear just what an
exceptional human being you are. You are a
shining example for us all.

I'm in awe.

Isn't it humbling to be in the presence of such integrity?



--
Dan

"Shut up! Shut up!"
- Bill O'Reilly

On Apr 11, 11:40*am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

From: Phil J

On behalf of everyone on this group, I want to thank you for making
clear just what an exceptional human being you are. *You are a shining
example for us all.

Phil

Thank you for the compliment.
When I become Supreme Dictator, your death will be quick and painless.

Well thanks! I appreciate that as I am really hoping to avoid a slow,
painful death. By the way, you might want to re-post your original
message such that it isn't removed in 6 days. That way future
generations can bask in the warm glow of your greatness.

Phil

"Jay Honeck" wrote:
I'm curious how they are getting 110 volts for your outlets. I
thought that was unattainable with current (sorry!) technology.

Go to www.amazon.com and enter "inverter" in their search field. You should
see dozens of products that plug into an automobile lighter outlet and
convert 12V DC to 110V AC (some up to 700 W). I have one in my car for use
on long trips (e.g. to recharge camera batteries, etc.) Most under $50.

gatt schrieb:
Germany has turned
solar-cell development into a national project similar to (...)

uhm, I wouldn't call it a national project, but it is recognised as a
serious industry.

#m

On 2008-04-11, wrote:
These are true sine wave inverters, are quite efficient, regulated, and
phase synchronized to the grid so switchover is transparent.

You can also get small UPSs with decent inverters, and they aren't
overly expensive.

But all this misses the point, the point was Jay believed it was
impossible to get 110vac with current technology, which is demonstrably
untrue (and has been untrue for decades).

Inverters and DC-DC converters don't need to be inefficient either, I've
not built my own inverters yet, but I've built a switch mode DC-DC
converter out of dirt cheap parts (CMOS 555, a handful of discrete
components including a chunky power FET, and a home made inductor) which
pushed 90% efficiency.

--
From the sunny Isle of Man.
Yes, the Reply-To email address is valid.

Dylan Smith wrote in
:

On 2008-04-11,
wrote:
These are true sine wave inverters, are quite efficient, regulated,
and phase synchronized to the grid so switchover is transparent.

You can also get small UPSs with decent inverters, and they aren't
overly expensive.

But all this misses the point, the point was Jay believed it was
impossible to get 110vac with current technology, which is
demonstrably untrue (and has been untrue for decades).

Many many decades. About 14 of them, to be precise. Inverters were
commonplace on large aircraft even in the 1930s and on ships before that.
These were all motor T/Rs, of course.
And ol Nikola Tesla would have been lost without them....



Bertie





Bertie

Martin Hotze wrote:
gatt schrieb:
Germany has turned solar-cell development into a national project
similar to (...)

uhm, I wouldn't call it a national project, but it is recognised as a
serious industry.

Thanks for the correction. Still, it's better then what the entire
United States of America has developed to date. Was a time when
Americans looked at what Germany did and said "We can do it better."

Now they look at what Germany is doing and say "Well, good for them."

Daimler recently bought Freightliner. According to a friend there, all
Daimler managers will be receiving a new Mercedes. Either they're
crushing US vehicle makers or they're crazy. ('Course, they're Germans
so it could go either way. ; )

-c

Jay Honeck schrieb:

I'm curious how they are getting 110 volts for your outlets. I thought
that was unattainable with current (sorry!) technology.

I don't know about the state of technology in the USA, but here in
Europe I've had a 220V inverter in my car 20 years ago, and it wasn't
exactly cutting edge technology then. Oh, and the artificial horizon I
have in my glider (yes, for cloud flying) runs on 3x115V 400Hz
three-phase AC, powered by the 12V battery pack.

The hilarious part of your post is that you think you're qualified to
comment about scientific and technologic research while you don't even
have the dimmest idea of such really basic stuff. As much as I detest
the posts of Bertie, he is right when he says that you don't have a clue.