Job well done

On Apr 20, 6:19*pm, wrote:
On Apr 18, 5:51 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:

This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear up is
not a life threatening event.

It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the engines and
done a belly landing
.
Cheers

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.


Why would he want to go around after short final? Are you saying the
POH says land on on one wheel? Now apply some PIC skills. Which is
safer, a belly landing with engines off or the crash landing the pilot
made?

Cheers

On Apr 20, 8:50*pm, Buttman wrote:
On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 23:19:37 -0700, momalley81 sayeth:



Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Sorry, I'll minimize the damage as best I can while following
manufacturer's approved procedures. *I'm betting nowhere in the 'ho's
AFM does it say to shut down and feather both engines on short final.

There are a million emergencies that can occur in a plane where there are
no procedures written about in the POH. There's nothing in the regs that
say you have to follow all "emergency procedures" in an emergency.
Handling an emergency isn't about just following what the book says.

They can't buy me a
new certificate when it gets yanked because I invented my own emergency
procedures.

Has this even ever happened before? Has there been an example of the FAA
going after someone who feathered the engines while doing a belly-up?



In fact they've been commended for their pilotage skills. Engines off
on short final is preferred for the fire risk.

Cheers

Buttman wrote in
:

On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 23:19:37 -0700, momalley81 sayeth:

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Sorry, I'll minimize the damage as best I can while following
manufacturer's approved procedures. I'm betting nowhere in the 'ho's
AFM does it say to shut down and feather both engines on short final.

There are a million emergencies that can occur in a plane where there
are no procedures written about in the POH. There's nothing in the
regs that say you have to follow all "emergency procedures" in an
emergency. Handling an emergency isn't about just following what the
book says.

They can't buy me a
new certificate when it gets yanked because I invented my own
emergency procedures.

Has this even ever happened before? Has there been an example of the
FAA going after someone who feathered the engines while doing a
belly-up?

If it was me, I'd consider feathering them, but only if I thought it
could be done effectively. If it's a three-blade, or a turboprop of
any kind, I won't do it. If there's a chance of going around I
wouldn't do it either, but since I learned to land consistently (back
in my pre-private checkride days) I've had to go around, what, twice?



You are an idiot.


Bertie

WingFlaps wrote in news:3ba51b9f-6384-43cf-9f74-
:

On Apr 20, 6:19*pm, wrote:
On Apr 18, 5:51 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:

This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear up
is
not a life threatening event.

It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less
damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the engines
and
done a belly landing
.
Cheers

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.


Why would he want to go around after short final? Are you saying the
POH says land on on one wheel? Now apply some PIC skills. Which is
safer, a belly landing with engines off or the crash landing the pilot
made?


Actually, a partial gear landing is considered safer. I've made on ( not
by choice, one failed on touchdown) and damage was minimal. The airplane
was flying agian the next day.


Bertie

On Apr 21, 2:07*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote in news:3ba51b9f-6384-43cf-9f74-
:







On Apr 20, 6:19*pm, wrote:
On Apr 18, 5:51 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:

This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear up
is
not a life threatening event.

It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less
damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the engines
and
done a belly landing
.
Cheers

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Why would he want to go around after short final? Are you saying the
POH says land on on one wheel? Now apply some PIC skills. Which is
safer, a belly landing with engines off or the crash landing the pilot
made?

Actually, a partial gear landing is considered safer. I've made on ( not
by choice, one failed on touchdown) and damage was minimal. The airplane
was flying agian the next day.


S'funny you say that as I was reading some RAF stories from the war
and it seemed like gear up was the way to go. The touble with one
wheel down is what happens to the wing wen it catches on the ground
and starts a groundloop. It seems to me that accidental gear ups do
relativeley little damage to structure.

Cheers

WingFlaps wrote in news:cc5e0db0-3e13-42b8-8d46-
:

On Apr 21, 2:07*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote in news:3ba51b9f-6384-43cf-
9f74-
:







On Apr 20, 6:19*pm, wrote:
On Apr 18, 5:51 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:

This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear
up
is
not a life threatening event.

It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less
damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the
engines
and
done a belly landing
.
Cheers

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Why would he want to go around after short final? Are you saying
the
POH says land on on one wheel? Now apply some PIC skills. Which is
safer, a belly landing with engines off or the crash landing the
pilot
made?

Actually, a partial gear landing is considered safer. I've made on (
not
by choice, one failed on touchdown) and damage was minimal. The
airplane
was flying agian the next day.


S'funny you say that as I was reading some RAF stories from the war
and it seemed like gear up was the way to go. The touble with one
wheel down is what happens to the wing wen it catches on the ground
and starts a groundloop. It seems to me that accidental gear ups do
relativeley little damage to structure.


Well, in my case it happened at high speed and we did eventually
groundloop, bt at low speed and with little damage. The left prop got
it, but the boss did a crank check and found it OK, so it flew the next
day. Cracked drag link was the culprit. For large aircraft, even those
without underslung engines, they do recommend that we take whatever is
down. I know a few guys who have landed completely wheels up and the
damage was pretty heavy. A Beech 99, for instance ( lots of those have
been wheels up)



Bertie

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
.. .
WingFlaps wrote in news:ca4e24f8-ae1d-43a2-b5c9-
:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:


This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear up is
not a life threatening event.


It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the engines and
done a belly landing

Maybe. We're told to get as many down as we can, though.

Bertie

Yeah, you're all just a bunch of dumb asses.

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
.. .
Buttman wrote in
:

On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 23:19:37 -0700, momalley81 sayeth:

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Sorry, I'll minimize the damage as best I can while following
manufacturer's approved procedures. I'm betting nowhere in the 'ho's
AFM does it say to shut down and feather both engines on short final.

There are a million emergencies that can occur in a plane where there
are no procedures written about in the POH. There's nothing in the
regs that say you have to follow all "emergency procedures" in an
emergency. Handling an emergency isn't about just following what the
book says.

They can't buy me a
new certificate when it gets yanked because I invented my own
emergency procedures.

Has this even ever happened before? Has there been an example of the
FAA going after someone who feathered the engines while doing a
belly-up?

If it was me, I'd consider feathering them, but only if I thought it
could be done effectively. If it's a three-blade, or a turboprop of
any kind, I won't do it. If there's a chance of going around I
wouldn't do it either, but since I learned to land consistently (back
in my pre-private checkride days) I've had to go around, what, twice?



You are an idiot.


Bertie

Your a dumb ass.

"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
.. .
WingFlaps wrote in news:cc5e0db0-3e13-42b8-8d46-
:

On Apr 21, 2:07 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote in news:3ba51b9f-6384-43cf-
9f74-
:







On Apr 20, 6:19 pm, wrote:
On Apr 18, 5:51 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:

This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear
up
is
not a life threatening event.

It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less
damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the
engines
and
done a belly landing
.
Cheers

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Why would he want to go around after short final? Are you saying
the
POH says land on on one wheel? Now apply some PIC skills. Which is
safer, a belly landing with engines off or the crash landing the
pilot
made?

Actually, a partial gear landing is considered safer. I've made on (
not
by choice, one failed on touchdown) and damage was minimal. The
airplane
was flying agian the next day.


S'funny you say that as I was reading some RAF stories from the war
and it seemed like gear up was the way to go. The touble with one
wheel down is what happens to the wing wen it catches on the ground
and starts a groundloop. It seems to me that accidental gear ups do
relativeley little damage to structure.


Well, in my case it happened at high speed and we did eventually
groundloop, bt at low speed and with little damage. The left prop got
it, but the boss did a crank check and found it OK, so it flew the next
day. Cracked drag link was the culprit. For large aircraft, even those
without underslung engines, they do recommend that we take whatever is
down. I know a few guys who have landed completely wheels up and the
damage was pretty heavy. A Beech 99, for instance ( lots of those have
been wheels up)



Bertie

Yeah, but you're just a liar.

On Apr 21, 3:17*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote in news:cc5e0db0-3e13-42b8-8d46-
:





On Apr 21, 2:07*am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
WingFlaps wrote in news:3ba51b9f-6384-43cf-
9f74-
:

On Apr 20, 6:19*pm, wrote:
On Apr 18, 5:51 pm, WingFlaps wrote:

On Apr 19, 7:37 am, "tom418" wrote:

This is only an emergency because it looks good on TV. A gear
up
is
not a life threatening event.

It would have been even less of a risk and done a lot less less
damage
to the plane if he had retracted the gear and stopped the
engines
and
done a belly landing
.
Cheers

Unless he had to go-around after feathering both engines.

Why would he want to go around after short final? Are you saying
the
POH says land on on one wheel? Now apply some PIC skills. Which is
safer, a belly landing with engines off or the crash landing the
pilot
made?

Actually, a partial gear landing is considered safer. I've made on (
not
by choice, one failed on touchdown) and damage was minimal. The
airplane
was flying agian the next day.

S'funny you say that as I was reading some RAF stories from the war
and it seemed like gear up was the way to go. The touble with one
wheel down is what happens to the wing wen it catches on the ground
and starts a groundloop. It seems to me that accidental gear ups do
relativeley little damage to structure.

Well, in my case it happened at high speed and we did eventually
groundloop, bt at low speed and with little damage. The left prop got
it, but the boss did a crank check and found it OK, so it flew the next
day. Cracked drag link was the culprit. For large aircraft, even those
without underslung engines, they do recommend that we take whatever is
down. I know a few guys who have landed completely wheels up and the
damage was pretty heavy. A Beech 99, for instance ( lots of those have
been wheels up)


For the Gulfstream III landing with any two (2) gear legs down and
locked is preferred to landing
with only one gear down or all gear up. Should only one gear be
extended, it is recommended
that the gear be retracted and an all gear up landing be performed.
Landing with only
the nose gear down and locked is specifically not recommended.

Do you know why it would be different for heavies?

Cheers