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#23
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On 24 Nov 2003 21:56:42 GMT, Regnirps wrote:
That's what I hate about rec.aviation.military. All the damn topic police! Discussion of the topic police is off topic for rec.aviation.military. -Jeff B. (here to help) yeff at erols dot com |
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On 24 Nov 2003 21:53:16 GMT, (Regnirps) wrote:
Mary Shafer wrote: We aren't willing to pay for the brightest, though. Say I'm good at math and I like it, so I can go into teaching for some miserable pittance or I can go into engineering for three times as much. If I'm as smart as you're hoping for, I'm too smart to go into teaching. And I save a year of college, because teaching takes five years and engineering takes the standard four years. It is true that teachers usually don't start very high, but in the Seattle area we have classroom teachers making over $60K and they have summers off and several one or two week breaks and frequent three day weekends. Not to mention that once they figure out a system they have a rather short work day. It think it is a pretty cushy racket with excellent retirement and benefits of all stripes. I come from a family full of teachers and as a child I thought everybody had summers off. Those teachers didn't get to $60M very quickly, either. They had to get a Master's, keep taking courses, and teach a lot of years, like twenty. My dad was a teacher and I can tell you that they may not spend eight hours every day in the classroom, but they make up for it with the time they spend working at home. And the summers off are spent taking compulsory courses for currency and increasing pay levels. There's no "working out a system", either, because schools change learning programs and texts, workbooks, whatnot, constantly. Plus you have to teach to constantly-changing standardized tests. Sixty thousand dollars is somewhat more than half of what I was making when I retired and I was a civil servant, meaning my pay wasn't that great. I wouldn't put up with teenagers all day for that. Or six-year-olds, come to think of it. Did you know that if you're in a fire and get a visible burn scar you can lose your teaching credential? Any disfigurement can do it, actually. That's not the sort of thing I'd like hanging over my head. I have been occasionally induced to look at special programs to get people from the sciences into teaching. Since I was laid off I have looked into them more seriously and so far thay have turned out to be political scams carefully designed to look good but be incompletable in practice, at least for someone who is broke :-) They're not designed for people who are broke; they're designed for those of us who took early retirement, like me, military folks, and some industry folks. Teaching would give us a chance to get more retirement benefits without having them docked the way Social Security is. To he who hath shall be given. Says so in the Bible. Well, it says more in the Bible than just that, but quoting out of context is a time-honored tradition. Seriously, I'm sorry they've been such a disappointment. Keep looking, as some may be more honest. Mary -- Mary Shafer Retired aerospace research engineer |
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George Shirley wrote:
I'm very proud of a young man I was fully prepared to beat to death at one time. They can change Gord, they just have to be motivated. BSEG George That's right George, they need to be shown the 'shining path' occasionally...nobody could be more horrified about child abuse (or any abuse actually) than I., but I firmly believe in enforcing Family Honour when necessary. I will say that it takes a wise man (or woman) to know when it's necessary though and to apply just the right amount (and type) of deterrent. I raised my four little tads to be extremely certain of receiving any punishment that I had promised...no more no less. One learns early not to promise that which one is reluctant to deliver. I think that we owe our children consistency. -- -Gord. |
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Regnirps wrote:
Mary Shafer wrote: Those teachers didn't get to $60M very quickly, either. They had to get a Master's, keep taking courses, and teach a lot of years, like twenty. My dad was a teacher and I can tell you that they may not spend eight hours every day in the classroom, but they make up for it with the time they spend working at home. And the summers off are spent taking compulsory courses for currency and increasing pay levels. My dad is a retired teacher (as is his brother). He picked up his masters when I was about two years old so it was his third year teaching. Back then there was not much in the way of continuing ed that had to be taken. It is his opinion that you can learn everything you need for the classroom in about three weeks. The Washington State Governor's progeram I looked into most recently required that someone with a math/science BS take five full load quarters of ed classes. It turned out to be a "trial program" with only 20 people being accepted. Location was an extension program not far from Microsoft headquarters so renting in the area was out of the question and commuting nearly impossible. It was supposedly aimed at people caught in the slump who had considered teaching in the past, but I suspect your explanation is much closer to the truth. My opinion is they set up the trial to fail. Probably half the students would find "real" jobs again in the five quarters the classes took. Half those left would shoot themselves after three quarters of nothing but mind numbing ed classes. In the end I bet maybe three teachers come out of it and it can be declared too inefficient to warrant further investment. Anyway, by the time I tracked down the program it was full. None of the school system or state school people could tell me a thing. It turned out that the only doorway was an obscure link starting on the Governor's web site! On the other hand, I have had some conflicting reports that some of the school systems do not require a certificate if you have a MS, PhD, or DrS. I think I can buy a Doctor of Science in physics or computer science from Manchester for about $1,200 :-) As for the high tech professions, have you seen anybody get hired at 52 lately? -- Charlie Springer I was out of work once and began substitute teaching. I don't know about Washington State but the districts (4) where I subbed in the Houston, TX area paid $60.00 a day back in the late eighties, some even threw in lunch. Here in Louisiana a certified teacher who subs gets $55.00 a day and uncertified gets $45.00. It isn't the best living in the world but it kept us with a roof over our heads and grub in the belly and ultimately led to full-time jobs for both of us. It's been my experience that if you have a job, any kind of job, it makes it easier to get a better one. May have to do with improved self-confidence, I'm not sure. Oh yeah, I started over with a whole new career at 52. I'm now 64 and self-employed and enjoyed the past 12 years more than I did the previous 30 odd years. Don't give up Charlie, there's always a job out there for us "experienced" people. George |
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George Shirley wrote in news:%XJwb.7771$I7.5019
@bignews6.bellsouth.net: It's been my experience that if you have a job, any kind of job, it makes it easier to get a better one. May have to do with improved self-confidence, I'm not sure. I would imagine that, atleast partially, it is a factor of the fact that that spending 6 months looking for a new job while your employed is easier then spending 6 months when you are unemployed. |
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