Standard rate turn in Boeing 757?

"Bob Moore" wrote in message
. 6...
"Jim Baker" wrote

Vince...everyone is entitled to their opinion. I've seen that tape
numerous times and I've done and taught several hundred aileron
rolls
(23 continuous ones once in a T-38) and barrel rolls. The 707
prototype that day over Lake Seattle did not do an aileron roll, it
was a barrel roll. He dove, he climbed and he did a constant
"speed"
roll about a point which is close to the definition of a barrel roll
as I can get without a book in front of me. An aileron roll is a
roll
about the longitudinal axis of the aircraft. He did not do a 360
roll
around the longitudinal axis.


Vince has it right. You must have missed last year's "barrel-roll
discussion", a portion of which is quoted from William Kershner's
book "The Flight Instructor's Manual". Do a newsgroup Google search
for barrel roll and you will find the entire debate between "Big John"
and myself.

"How-
You might use the following explanation, or develop your own:
(1) Make sure the area is clear, then pick a reference on
the horizon off the wing tip as in the wingover and lazy eight.
(2) Set the throttle to low cruise rpm and ease the nose over to pick-
up about 10 K more than used for the wingover or set up the
airspeed used for a loop, whichever is higher. Power adjustment
should not be necessary during the maneuver. You might have
some of your sharper trainees apply full power as the airplane
approaches inverted and then remind them to throttle back as the
airspeed picks up in the last part of the maneuver.
(3) Smoothly pull the nose up and start a coordinated climbing turn
(note that it will have to be at a much faster rate than was used
for the wingover) toward the reference point. (Assume that at
first
the roll will be to the left.)
(4) When the nose is 45° from the original heading, it should be at
its
highest pitch attitude and the left bank should be vertical.
(5) When the nose is at 90° from the original heading, you should be
looking directly at the reference point that was originally off
the
wing tipfrom a completely inverted position (momentarily).
(6) When the airplane heading is again 45° from the original, the bank
is vertical but you will be in a right bank as far as the ground
is
concerned; that is, the right wing is pointing straight down at
this
instant of roll. The nose will be at its lowest pitch attitude at
this point.
(7) The roll is continued to wings-level flight as the nose is raised
back to the cruise attitude."

Note that half-way through the maneuver, the nose of the airplane
is 90 degrees to original heading at the same time that the airplane
is inverted.

Bob Moore


This is simply the "classic" method of teaching a barrel roll. A barrel
roll is simply a 3 dimensional maneuver, and in fact in air combat
maneuvering, is the ONLY 3 dimensional maneuver through 3 dimensional
space. The roll can be performed as written by you and Kershner here, or
it can be flown much tighter. Any roll that is FLOWN through
3 dimensions while maintaining a positive g on the airplane is a barrel
roll. The "barrel" can also be altered while in the roll by changing the
load on the airplane.In fact, in one offshoot scenario in the ACM arena,
we often began a barrel roll with positive g, then unloaded the airplane
to just below ballistic in the roll. (speeds up the roll rate :-)
Tex's roll was absolutely a barrel roll.

Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/ CFI Retired
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