Safety of winch launch vrs. aero tow?

Yes, JJ was one of my two instructors at Dunstable 40 years ago (John
Jeffries, not to be confused with some young whippersnapper from Nevada who
has hijacked these initials).

I remember the way he used to fly, and it is obvious that some things don't
change.

My other instructor was Mike Till, I flew with him mostly, I see he is on
the current roster.

As to launch failures generally, aerotow failures will often involve
outlandings, fortunately such failures are rare compared with wire launch
failures.

There has been considerable discussion as to how aerotow failures should be
taught, since it is important that the pupil should not assume that the
airfield can always be reached. It maybe that JJ could get back, but this
does not mean that you can when it happens for real. Instructors are apt
to pull a simulated failure when it is still possible to get back, though
only just with JJ. There is a lot to be said for using a motor-glider for
teaching aerotow landing options, though JJ won't like this idea!

In real life some aerotow operations are carried out where an aerotow
failure may result at best in a controlled crash. Remember that if the tug
has an engine problem it may operate at low power before failing, so you
will be slower and lower than on a normal tow before you abandon the tow or
it abandons you.

As to wire launch failures at Dunstable, yes there is often a very narrow
gap between being too low to turn and too high to get in straight ahead.
It is certainly a good idea to have fields outside the airfield in mind when
reviewing the options while doing the launch failure bit of "eventualities"
before starting the launch. Often the field is partly blocked by gliders
awaiting retrieve, and tractors on their way to do the retrieve. If you do
not think of an option when reviewing options before starting, you are
unlikely to think of it when conducting a very high pressure recovery which
is by definition not expected (though it must be thought about).

W.J. (Bill) Dean (U.K.).
Remove "ic" to reply.


"Stephen Haley" wrote in message
...

I still fly at Dunstable and can say that there can still be a problem on
very still days off the winch where you have too much height to land
straight ahead but not enough to turn safely. This is especially true
for abinitios/early solos. Unfortunately Dunstable is still far from
flat and still has a horrendous dip to the downs side over half the field
with the other half having being filled in with spoil from the M1 making
diagonal landings in that direction difficult/impossible unless you want
to do a lemming act off the cliff edge that bisects part of the field but
at least the hedge has been partially removed on part of the southern edge
leaving the option of running on into a ploughed field. While I have
never seen an outfield landing following a winch break I could see it
happening a calm days with certain glider types.

Aerotowing in strong easterly winds out towards the downs - that is best
confined to the horror vault. The wind coming across the top of the
downs produces a very violent wave pattern across the field and just as
you are getting to the roughest part where it feels like the wind is
almost vertical and trying to slam you back into the field the tug has to
execute a sharp right turn at v low altitude. There are parts of the
field where the wave effect produces a complete wind shadow.

As for being pulled off at 200ft - I wish. One of JJs (who probably
taught the previous poster) last acts before retiring for the winter was
to pull me off over the sw hedge - luckily we have a dip a bit further on
that gives another 40 ft and somehow I got it down back on the field after
a 270. When I asked him later if it was circa 150ft I was given the
laconic comment - "Not as much as that - remember each wing is only 30ft
so you dont need a lot providing you remember you already have flying
speed and fly the turn precisely". I never did have the courage to ask
him exactly how high we were.


"W.J. (Bill) Dean (U.K.)." wrote in message
...

Not always.

I learnt to fly at the London Gliding Club, Dunstable Downs some 40
years ago, entirely on the winch, and on the T21b.

There was one run for which I was taught that the correct procedure for
a launch failure at a certain height was to land beyond the airfield
boundary in the farmer's field.

The point surely is that before the launch starts the pilot should have
in mind all the possible options to cope with any launch failure; this
may include an off-airfield landing for either a wire or an aerotow
launch.

Incidentally, the London Club now has more land, and outlandings after a
winch launch failure are not now required.

W.J. (Bill) Dean (U.K.).


"Bill Daniels" wrote in message
nk.net...

snip

My original point was that with airtow stuff happens and sometimes you
aren't in position for a return to the runway. In winch launching,
you are.

Bill Daniels