Nearly Mid-Air Collision at Estrella

be interesting to know where you where when you saw the B-1...

do you know if there were any IR or VR routes in your area? or were you
inside a MOA

and trust me.. when down low and fast.. two sets of eyes are looking outside
and forward..

BT

"C.Fleming" wrote in message
...
It sounds like a scary 10-15 seconds! I know the feeling: I too have had
close encounters with jets. I've been closer than I would have liked to
737's, F-117's, and a B1-b with its wings fully swept back flying
Nap-of-the-Earth. With one 737, I saw its shadow flying directly at mine,
but it took several seconds for me to find it. The other 737 was pointed
out to me by the Approach controller, but neither of us saw each other.
The
flight of F-117's I'm sure saw me, for they came up from behind and on my
right, and overtook me on a parallel course. They got my heart pounding
though! But it was the B1-B about 1,000 feet below flying at nearly the
speed of sound that scared the bejeezers out of me! Yes, keep your eyes
outside 99% of the time. Feel for the lift, listen to the audio vario,
and
look outside. Not only does this help keep aluminum off of fiberglass,
but
it improves your piloting technique as well.

A couple of points about the Harriers you encountered though:
1.) They may or may not have been in contact with ATC, and even if they
were, there would be no separation requirements between them and you.
2.) Military aircraft do not have the 200 knot limitation under the Class
B
airspace.
3.) Jet pilots tend not to look outside of the cockpit nearly as much as
we
do, and even if they did, it would be extremely difficult for them to see
us. There was a video made of a near-miss a couple of years ago between
an
F-16 and a Cessna 172. The footage was from the Heads-Up Display (HUD) of
the F-16. They missed by 15 feet, and you had to play the video in slow
motion to even see the Cessna.

I know those points don't give us a warm and fuzzy feeling, but that's the
world we live in. The best advice that I have is to either avoid the
areas
of high risk, communicate with the controlling agency, or work from within
the system to keep the aircraft apart from each other through a Letter of
Agreement (LOA).

Fly safe,
Chris Fleming, 'L9'
ATP B-767, CFI-G


"Terry Claussen" wrote in message
...

I have no idea if they were IFR, nor if they could, should or did
comply with the 200 KIAS speed limit under the shelf of the class B. I
also have no idea whether either I or the other glider was seen by the
lead. After the encounter, I lost my enthusiasm for the flight along
with the thermal and worked my way back to the sailport.

When I fly with students in this area, I hammer the idea that our
piece of the sky is busy due to the natural and man-created boundaries
which will force through traffic to overfly our thermal hunting area.
So I received yet another reminder that I cannot see everything even
part of the time. Were one of the Harriers and me to collide does
anyone think that the TV would have the blame anywhere other than me?

Let's be careful out there. I think I am, but again I got another
chance.

Terry Claussen