spoilers vs. ailerons

" wrote in message
...
Ron Natalie wrote in message
.. .
wrote:
The definition of stalled [...] is a definition based on
aircraft handling and controllability.

Says who?

The certification requirements. They do not mention in any way a specific
aoa.

They don't even define stall. What makes you think they define it based on
handling rather than AOA?

Perhaps you are confused (for example) by the wording of 23.49(a). When
they say "VSO and VS1 are the stalling speeds or the minimum steady flight
speeds, in knots (CAS), at which the airplane is controllable", that means:

"VSO and VS1 are (the stalling speeds) or (the minimum steady flight speeds,
in knots (CAS), at which the airplane is controllable)"

Or perhaps you are mistaking the FAA's requirement for how to *identify* a
stall for a definition of one. See 23.201(b). You'll note that the
requirement in 23.201(b) even applies to airplanes that don't actually stall
under the conditions described, such as the Ercoupe. The FAA is well aware
that those airplanes are not stalling.

The FAA uses the same definition for stall that everyone else does.

[...] Back to little planes. The stall varies widely, mostly
depending on weight and cg position.

True.

For example at forward cg, the stall is often determined by running out
of elevator travel.

False. Unless by "often" you mean "rarely".

The airplane isn't really stalled, but the certification requirements
say it is.

Also false. Even for the rare airplane where a forward CG means the
elevator doesn't have enough authority to create a stall, the FAA doesn't
call that situation a stall. They simply use that situation to define a
specific speed.

Don't be confused by the fact that the speed defined is often referred to as
the stall speed. It's not the stall speed, it's Vs0 and Vs1 (as
appropriate).

[...] I'm sure that I have not covered the issue well at all.

I can certainly agree with that.

It would be a good exercise pull up the certification requirements
for light aircraft and read them.

I can agree with that as well. Perhaps you should try it again, this time
reading them correctly.

[...]
One other thing. Stall speeds vary considerably with entry rate. The regs
specify a 1 knot per second entry rate. At slower entry rates, the stall
speed is higher.

So, you're saying as the entry rate approaches 0 knots per second, the stall
speed goes to infinity?

Um, seems to me you have this backwards.

[...] "There I was, turning final
above stall speed and the plane dove into the ground." Turning flight.
Slow
speed decline. It adds up.

Perhaps, but your post doesn't.

Speaking of which, maybe you could look into your whole line-lengths thing.
It is customary to either limit your line lengths to 72 characters or less,
or to not limit them at all. The former is much more common, but at least
with the latter the post is still readable in *some* newsreaders.

Pete