Mountain High Cannula/Mask?

On Wednesday, October 2, 2019 at 6:17:16 AM UTC-5, Tango Eight wrote:
On Tuesday, October 1, 2019 at 3:44:11 PM UTC-4, RR wrote:

The legalitys are not so clear [...]

FAR 23.1447 spells it out (for certificated aircraft). Above 18K the requirement is for a mask that covers nose and mouth.

The fact that some people can get away with a cannula at 26K (once) does not mean that this is a sound practice. We've had two hypoxia incidents (that I know of) at Mt Washington due to pilots emulating certain old timers. Physiology varies. Physical fitness doesn't seem to be a factor (in fact casual observation suggests the reverse :-)).

T8

Yes, this applies to required aircraft equipment, not pilot use under part 91.
BUT -- everyone is different.
There was a study done with *young, fit* pilots showing that the Mtn High canula *could* keep O2 sats above 90% to FL035.
But the older and un-fitter we get, and bearing in mind the large individual differences,
The only safe thing, if you're flying above FL012, is to spend $180 or whatever and buy a good wris****ch-style oximeter and take the reading from a warm finger -- and *verify* that your oxygen supply is at least getting to your finger.
And remember, the normal, physiological hyperventilation of low pressure altitudes can decrease brain perfusion by about 20% while finger perfusion remains normal.
Bottom line: if you feel stupid, you are stupid, and it's time to descend no matter what the oxygen system is doing and no matter what the oximeter says. Been there.
DrDan

Dr Dan, Great article on Oxygen hazards, but pages 22 & 23 are missing (possibly a full page ad in there). I have a feeling there's something we should know in the missing page(s).

RR wrote on 10/1/2019 12:44 PM:
On Tuesday, October 1, 2019 at 6:45:06 AM UTC-4, John McLaughlin wrote:
Does everyone stick to the 18k limit for the cannula and 25k for the mask,

or are these limits considered advisory only?

The legalitys are not so clear, but practically it is about remembering to breathe only with your nose with the cannula. Something I felt i could do, and so far have remembered. It is much easier to hydrate and communicate with the cannula. Just don't forget...

The Mountain high EDS units will alarm if you don't breathe frequently enough, so
that might be sufficient to remind pilots to breather through their nose.
Continuous use of an oximeter that alarms with a low SPO2% may be a useful
additional reminder to breathe properly, and I think I would use one even if I was
using a mask.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1

Non smoker, rather active, good health.....may be fine.
Couch potato, smoker, heart issues, etc., may be in bad shape walking in Denver, let alone flying higher....yes, I have had to run through the Denver airport from a late flight trying to catch a connecting flight.....sucked carrying a heavy bag...
YMMV......

Yes, finger probe (I believe under $100US) will basically tell you how you're doing on O2.

On Tuesday, October 1, 2019 at 6:16:30 PM UTC-4, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
Non smoker, rather active, good health.....may be fine.
Couch potato, smoker, heart issues, etc., may be in bad shape walking in Denver, let alone flying higher....yes, I have had to run through the Denver airport from a late flight trying to catch a connecting flight.....sucked carrying a heavy bag...
YMMV......

Yes, finger probe (I believe under $100US) will basically tell you how you're doing on O2.

Unless you hyperventilate. What happens then?

T8

On Tuesday, October 1, 2019 at 3:16:30 PM UTC-7, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
Non smoker, rather active, good health.....may be fine.
Couch potato, smoker, heart issues, etc., may be in bad shape walking in Denver, let alone flying higher....yes, I have had to run through the Denver airport from a late flight trying to catch a connecting flight.....sucked carrying a heavy bag...
YMMV......

Yes, finger probe (I believe under $100US) will basically tell you how you're doing on O2.

You can get them for $15 now, and better ones for $25.

According to tests, even the cheapest are accurate, it just comes down to build quality and extra features e.g. nice graph of your pulse depth (and numerical assessment of that), BlueTooth connection to your phone etc.

I just got an "Innovo Deluxe Fingertip Pulse Oximeter with Plethysmograph and Perfusion Index" for $26.99. I haven't used it in anger yet, but I'm planning to see what it says on my 12 hour flight from SFO to AKL tonight :-) It seems good so far.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0..._title_o00_s00

On Tuesday, October 1, 2019 at 5:12:51 PM UTC-7, Bruce Hoult wrote:
On Tuesday, October 1, 2019 at 3:16:30 PM UTC-7, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
Non smoker, rather active, good health.....may be fine.
Couch potato, smoker, heart issues, etc., may be in bad shape walking in Denver, let alone flying higher....yes, I have had to run through the Denver airport from a late flight trying to catch a connecting flight.....sucked carrying a heavy bag...
YMMV......

Yes, finger probe (I believe under $100US) will basically tell you how you're doing on O2.

You can get them for $15 now, and better ones for $25.

According to tests, even the cheapest are accurate, it just comes down to build quality and extra features e.g. nice graph of your pulse depth (and numerical assessment of that), BlueTooth connection to your phone etc.

I just got an "Innovo Deluxe Fingertip Pulse Oximeter with Plethysmograph and Perfusion Index" for $26.99. I haven't used it in anger yet, but I'm planning to see what it says on my 12 hour flight from SFO to AKL tonight :-) It seems good so far.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0..._title_o00_s00

My Sansung Galaxy S8 phone with the Samsung Health app has a pulse oximeter.

Richard
www.craggyaero.com