$429 Dimmer Switch

You paid someone to change light bulbs?

Well, not directly. They just replaced them (and the missing blue
condom-thingies that go over them) while they were there.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

And you still refuse to learn how to use a multimeter and get your hands dirty?

Sheesh. There is no hope.

{;-)

Jim



"Jay Honeck"
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

-And it's not even for the Dept. of Defense! :-)
-
-For those of you thinking about airplane ownership (and I know you're
-lurking out there!), we just got the bill to replace one of the two dimmer
-switches (and a few light bulbs) in our Pathfinder's panel.
-
-$104 in parts, 5 hours labor (It's a real bitch to diagnose and get at in a
-Cherokee...).
-
-Total: $429.73.
-
-Gotta love aviation.

Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

Jim Weir wrote:

And you still refuse to learn how to use a multimeter and get your hands dirty?

The last few posts by Mr. Honeck usually contained the words "inn full" and "no
time", or similar phrases. If it took a skilled professional 5 hours to find and
fix, how long do you think it would've taken Jay to do it?

Paying the mech was probably a good deal cheaper in the short run.

George Patterson
Battle, n; A method of untying with the teeth a political knot that would
not yield to the tongue.

"Jay Honeck" writes:

And it's not even for the Dept. of Defense! :-)

For those of you thinking about airplane ownership

Here is a test my mechanic suggested for those thinking about buying a
plane (or boat, etc).

Go to the bank and request $100 from your account. Get the cash in
the form of a crisp new $100 bill.

Go outside, and with a match or lighter set fire to the $100 bill.
Hold it in your hand and watch it burn. Throw the remainder on the
ground, grind it out, get in your car and drive away.

If this doesn't bother you in the least then you are ready to buy. If
it does, better take up some other hobby.

"Bob Fry" wrote in message
...
"Jay Honeck" writes:

And it's not even for the Dept. of Defense! :-)

For those of you thinking about airplane ownership

Here is a test my mechanic suggested for those thinking about buying a
plane (or boat, etc).

Go to the bank and request $100 from your account. Get the cash in
the form of a crisp new $100 bill.

Go outside, and with a match or lighter set fire to the $100 bill.
Hold it in your hand and watch it burn. Throw the remainder on the
ground, grind it out, get in your car and drive away.

If this doesn't bother you in the least then you are ready to buy. If
it does, better take up some other hobby.

So...you think flying is a waste of money?

Jay Honeck wrote:
: $104 in parts, 5 hours labor (It's a real bitch to diagnose and get at in a
: Cherokee...).

You got a good deal. I paid $179 for the right hand dimmer switch in my
Cherokee 180's panel 2 years ago. Not including installation, which broke
within 1 hour because the mechanic (1) couldn't solder and (2) had no
notion of how to properly suppport soldered wires against vibration.

--
Aaron Coolidge (N9376J)

$104 in parts, 5 hours labor (It's a real bitch to diagnose and get at in a
Cherokee...).

Total: $429.73.

Gotta love aviation.

As a confirmed "lingerer" it broke my heart to hit the reply button, but as a
30+ year general aviation mechanic, ham radio hobby buff, and electronic hobby
tinkerer, I felt compelled to add my voice here. Any body that understands
that tranistorized dimming system (and its just not that complicated) SHOULD
KNOW to verify that the light chain is not shorted before sticking in a new
transistor. A short is about the only thing I've ever seen that will kill the
otherwise beefy 2N3055 transistor. I'm not trying to brag about my skills but
just stating facts.....I could have had that problem diagnosed in about 15
minutes and had the transistor changed in less than two hours....and I know
better than to try to light the lights before I correct the short in the light
chain.....'cause if ya don't.....guess what.....there goes another transistor.
Sounds like you need another mechanic...at least another one to deal with
electrical/electronic problems.

And to Mr. Weir......the 337 is for Major repair and Major ALTERATIONS. As
the chief inspector for a large repair station, if I see an aircraft for an
annual with some kind of aftermarket or home made dimmer system....it better
have a 337 associated with it....not because I'm a jerk or an a**hole, but
because that is what the regulations require. Unfortunately, if I ignore that
or miss that and the owner rolls the aircraft into a ball, even if it had
nothing to do with the accident, I could be in big trouble with the feds or
possibly be sued by the estate and loose every thing I've worked so hard for
these last 30 plus years. I've been the biz long enough to have seen that when
there is an accident with death or serious injury, the FAA and the lawyers go
after any body they can get their hooks into....and if I haven't towed the line
with the regulations, it could be implied that I have been neglegent in my job.

If you want to own and fly a certificated aircraft, then do so in accordance
with the regs, if you're a tinkerer and enjoy working on your own ship....and
more power to you, then build a home-built and any thing goes....even doing
your own yearly condition inspections.

Oh no! Someone having the audacity to disagree with King Weir!
That'll make him spit out his morning latte! Stand by for the flames.

Good points John, and I agree wholeheartedly, but can you expect every
A&P to fully understand each and every detail? I don't care to pay
for an A&P's education, but it's almost like saying that you obtained
your 30 years in a few months.


On 13 Mar 2004 12:31:27 GMT, ospam (JohnN3TWN)
wrote:

As a confirmed "lingerer" it broke my heart to hit the reply button, but as a
30+ year general aviation mechanic, ham radio hobby buff, and electronic hobby
tinkerer, I felt compelled to add my voice here. Any body that understands
that tranistorized dimming system (and its just not that complicated) SHOULD
KNOW to verify that the light chain is not shorted before sticking in a new
transistor. A short is about the only thing I've ever seen that will kill the
otherwise beefy 2N3055 transistor. I'm not trying to brag about my skills but
just stating facts.....I could have had that problem diagnosed in about 15
minutes and had the transistor changed in less than two hours....and I know
better than to try to light the lights before I correct the short in the light
chain.....'cause if ya don't.....guess what.....there goes another transistor.
Sounds like you need another mechanic...at least another one to deal with
electrical/electronic problems.

And to Mr. Weir......the 337 is for Major repair and Major ALTERATIONS. As
the chief inspector for a large repair station, if I see an aircraft for an
annual with some kind of aftermarket or home made dimmer system....it better
have a 337 associated with it....not because I'm a jerk or an a**hole, but
because that is what the regulations require. Unfortunately, if I ignore that
or miss that and the owner rolls the aircraft into a ball, even if it had
nothing to do with the accident, I could be in big trouble with the feds or
possibly be sued by the estate and loose every thing I've worked so hard for
these last 30 plus years. I've been the biz long enough to have seen that when
there is an accident with death or serious injury, the FAA and the lawyers go
after any body they can get their hooks into....and if I haven't towed the line
with the regulations, it could be implied that I have been neglegent in my job.

If you want to own and fly a certificated aircraft, then do so in accordance
with the regs, if you're a tinkerer and enjoy working on your own ship....and
more power to you, then build a home-built and any thing goes....even doing
your own yearly condition inspections.

Good points John, and I agree wholeheartedly, but can you expect every
A&P to fully understand each and every detail? I don't care to pay
for an A&P's education, but it's almost like saying that you obtained
your 30 years in a few months.

My A&P is the best engine and airframe man I've seen.

However, when it comes to electrical, even he will admit that he's a "figure
it as you go" guy, even though he works on DC-9s most of the time.

Personally, I think the dimmer circuitry in the Cherokee is perhaps the
dumbest thing I've seen in aviation. Even I, as a total neophyte, can see
that the system is hopelessly obtuse.

Strangely, older Cherokees had a much simpler dimmer circuit. I wonder why
Piper made it so complex later on, and I wonder if they've corrected this
mess in their new planes?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay,

I have one of those older dimmer systems, and it is no picnic. The old one is
just a power rheostat wired in with the lights. The rheostat heats up because
it handles all the power. That transistor circuit simply controls the current
by using the transistor to amplify small current changes in the rheostat. The
result is the rheostat needn't be a custom high power one, and it won't burn out
as easily. The rheostat only dimmer gets hot to the touch if you have more than
just the original overhead light and compass light on it, and probably can't
handle a full panel worth of lighting. I'd trade the simple older dimmer for
the transistorized one if it we cheap and painless to do. When my dimmer does
go, or I add more lighting to the panel, I'll probably opt for one of the pulse
width modulated ones (those are much more complicated than the piper pass
transistor, but they also dissipate very little power).

Jay Honeck wrote:

Good points John, and I agree wholeheartedly, but can you expect every
A&P to fully understand each and every detail? I don't care to pay
for an A&P's education, but it's almost like saying that you obtained
your 30 years in a few months.

My A&P is the best engine and airframe man I've seen.

However, when it comes to electrical, even he will admit that he's a "figure
it as you go" guy, even though he works on DC-9s most of the time.

Personally, I think the dimmer circuitry in the Cherokee is perhaps the
dumbest thing I've seen in aviation. Even I, as a total neophyte, can see
that the system is hopelessly obtuse.

Strangely, older Cherokees had a much simpler dimmer circuit. I wonder why
Piper made it so complex later on, and I wonder if they've corrected this
mess in their new planes?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

--
--Ray Andraka, P.E.
President, the Andraka Consulting Group, Inc.
401/884-7930 Fax 401/884-7950
email
http://www.andraka.com

"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-Benjamin Franklin, 1759