Freelance CFIs and plane rentals??

Your friend can rent the airplane from the FBO and give you dual
instruction without any restriction. But the problem comes when you
have to fly solo or fly solo cross countries. What you might want to
do is take the majority of your instruction with your friend, and then
switch to one of the FBO instructors and have them sign off your solo.
You have to do the same for the cross countries as well. This is a
hassle, but I really don't see how an FBO will allow a stranger to
sign off another stranger to take their airplanes on solo flights. If
your friend has done a lot of CFI work in the past he must have some
ideas on how to do this or know someone in the community who could
help.




(Sam) wrote in message . com...
I posted a message awhile back about one of my relatives offering me
free flight instruction. He's a very experienced airline pilot and
has done a lot of CFI work in the past. He's still current on his CFI
rating, and the plan is to begin training in June (when I have more
money and he has more time).

Do you think there will be any problem with one of the local FBOs
renting us a plane for my training? Obviously they'll want to check
him out and see his history, but beyond that is there anything I need
to know? Obviously we should just make a couple of calls and see what
their policy is, but I just wanted to know if this was a common
situation or not first. TIA!

Sam

(Andrew Sarangan) wrote in message . com...
Your friend can rent the airplane from the FBO and give you dual
instruction without any restriction.

Very unlikely. I've never seen a club, FBO that didn't explicitly
state that only club approved CFIs can give instruction. Most also
prohibit flying from the right seat just to ensure you aren't giving
instruction.

(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message . com...
(Andrew Sarangan) wrote in message . com...
Your friend can rent the airplane from the FBO and give you dual
instruction without any restriction.

Very unlikely. I've never seen a club, FBO that didn't explicitly
state that only club approved CFIs can give instruction. Most also
prohibit flying from the right seat just to ensure you aren't giving
instruction.

I've seen that too, but I don't see how they can make the distinction
between flight instruction and taking a passenger flying.

(Andrew Sarangan) wrote in message . com...
(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message . com...
(Andrew Sarangan) wrote in message . com...
Your friend can rent the airplane from the FBO and give you dual
instruction without any restriction.

Very unlikely. I've never seen a club, FBO that didn't explicitly
state that only club approved CFIs can give instruction. Most also
prohibit flying from the right seat just to ensure you aren't giving
instruction.

I've seen that too, but I don't see how they can make the distinction
between flight instruction and taking a passenger flying.

Its just not good relations to violate a policy of the FBO just
because you don't think you'll be caught. As pilots, we still live in
a pretty small community and word of pilots (especially CFIs) gets
around pretty fast, even in large towns. We've all heard stories of
the crazy CFIs in the area. You don't want to be bundled up with those
guys.

(Andrew Sarangan) wrote in message . com...
(Robert M. Gary) wrote in message . com...
Very unlikely. I've never seen a club, FBO that didn't explicitly
state that only club approved CFIs can give instruction. Most also
prohibit flying from the right seat just to ensure you aren't giving
instruction.

I've seen that too, but I don't see how they can make the distinction
between flight instruction and taking a passenger flying.

It might be difficult before the fact, but this would certainly come
out in an accident investigation. That could put the instructor in
some very hot water (financially speaking).

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message om...
Your friend can rent the airplane from the FBO and give you dual
instruction without any restriction.

Depends on the FBO. Believe me, our policy back when I was in
the flying club required that the only instruction be done by the club
instructors. A renter who just happened to be a CFI could not give
instruction even to ohter club members.

A renter who just happened to be a CFI could not give
instruction even to ohter club members.


I presume "renter" means "club member who rents from the club"... then why
doesn't the club simply approve the CFI club member as an approved instructor?

Jose

--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

"Teacherjh" wrote in message ...

A renter who just happened to be a CFI could not give
instruction even to ohter club members.


I presume "renter" means "club member who rents from the club"... then why
doesn't the club simply approve the CFI club member as an approved instructor?

That option was available to the CFI-member, but some for whatever reason choose
not to do so.

(Sam) wrote in message . com...
I posted a message awhile back about one of my relatives offering me
free flight instruction. He's a very experienced airline pilot and
has done a lot of CFI work in the past. He's still current on his CFI
rating, and the plan is to begin training in June (when I have more
money and he has more time).

Do you think there will be any problem with one of the local FBOs
renting us a plane for my training? Obviously they'll want to check
him out and see his history, but beyond that is there anything I need
to know? Obviously we should just make a couple of calls and see what
their policy is, but I just wanted to know if this was a common
situation or not first. TIA!

As far as I know, there are no FBOs in the U.S. that have CFI's as
employees. We are almost always "1099" not "W-2". I think this helps
divorse the liability of having employees.
Your question really varies by the FBO. There are many FBOs in
Sacramento that will not consider it unless you want to fly full time
for them. There are others that just want you to sign up as a member
of their club. In general the professional training type places are
not likely to permit this. I'm an independent CFI and know of several
places I can get planes to teach in and places that I can't. The
bottom line is, you need to call.

Also, make sure this guy is really commited to training you. Accepting
a student is a BIG responsibility and I don't believe you should take
it on unless you are willing to see the student all the way through.

-Robert, CFI

"Robert M. Gary" wrote in message
om...
(Sam) wrote in message
. com...

As far as I know, there are no FBOs in the U.S. that have CFI's as
employees. We are almost always "1099" not "W-2". I think this helps
divorse the liability of having employees.

I am an employee of PAVCO as a CFI and get a W-2.

A lot of places that claim that their instructors are 'independent'
contractors are asking to get bitten by their state labor regulators. Some
states allow anyone who claims that they are a contractor to be treated as
one, but some others get downright nasty.

There is no liability protection in having contractors instead of employees.
It is a tax and labor issue. Employers have to pay employer taxes for their
employees and withhold income taxes and deposit them on a regular basis.
They have to pay their employees minimum wage. They have to pay their
employees for all work they do. Both states and the federal government take
a dim view of businesses that attempt to evade taxes and labor laws by
calling their employees 'independent' contractors.

If a CFI was really an independent contractor he could not be required to
perform any additional duties, could not be told how to do his job, could
not be required to use company planes, could not be forbidden to give flight
instruction on his own time or at other FBOs, etc. Some states require
anyone working as a contractor to have a license or otherwise register as a
business.

The first time a 'contractor' CFI gets hurt on the job and files a workman's
compensation claim (or even inadvertently admits to hospital personnel that
he was injured on the job) then the state is going to come looking for back
taxes, penalties, interest, and a real good reason why this CFI should not
be eligible for compensation at the employer's expense. A good argument can
be made that calling your instructors contractors actually increases your
liability exposure a great deal. Employees are easier to insure and much
easier to manage.