The price of gas

"In a democracy, the people eventually get what they want." I don't know
who originally said that, but its true. The people have what they "PREFER".
The perfectly fair system is the one where everyone is equally unhappy.

Mike
MU-2

"Wdtabor" wrote in message
...
At some price point it will
be favorable to either deal with this government's licensing and build
capacity here or to adjust the distribution and ship from refineries in
other countries. Or does simple economics break down when dealing with
oil?

But that price point wil be lower if the government simply gets out of the
way
and lets the market do it's thing, leaving us more money to spend on
avionics
or hookers or dentistry or whatever other item we would PREFER to spend
our
money to obtain.

--
Wm. Donald (Don) Tabor Jr., DDS
PP-ASEL
Chesapeake, VA - CPK, PVG

Or does simple economics break down when dealing with oil?

There is more than a bit of truth in that off-handed remark.

While the laws of economics still work, the normal structure of supply and
demand sure doesn't. There is nothing "simple" about economics when
dealing with oil.

There are simply too many countries, too many ideologies, too many axes to
grind, and too much money involved for this to be anything but difficult.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Peter Gottlieb opined

"Tom Sixkiller" wrote in message
...

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
nk.net...
When it is profitable enough then more refining capacity will be built.

Don't think so. Couldn't do it if they if they wanted to. If the regs were
"relaxed", it would still be prohibitive after the cost of dealing with
the
regs were amortized.


If refining is so incredibly expensive here then why isn't the refining
being done where it is cheaper and the final product shipped here for
consumption?

WE are importing refined products from Europe and Venezuala. 10 or 20%, IIRC.
But it is an inflexible pipeline, and some overseas refineries are not willing
to upgrade in order to produce the latest EPA mandated concoctions.

The logical conclusion is that refining here, with all the regulations, is
still economically favorable as compared to refining elsewhere.




-ash
Cthulhu for President!
Why vote for a lesser evil?

"Ash Wyllie" wrote in message
...
Peter Gottlieb opined

"Tom Sixkiller" wrote in message
...

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
nk.net...
When it is profitable enough then more refining capacity will be
built.

Don't think so. Couldn't do it if they if they wanted to. If the regs
were
"relaxed", it would still be prohibitive after the cost of dealing with
the
regs were amortized.


If refining is so incredibly expensive here then why isn't the refining
being done where it is cheaper and the final product shipped here for
consumption?

WE are importing refined products from Europe and Venezuala. 10 or 20%,
IIRC.
But it is an inflexible pipeline, and some overseas refineries are not
willing
to upgrade in order to produce the latest EPA mandated concoctions.

The logical conclusion is that refining here, with all the regulations,
is
still economically favorable as compared to refining elsewhere.

The conclusion might be at the end of your previous paragraph.

I've heard that US refineries are operating at damn near 100% of ALLOWED
capacity. Can anyone verify that?

Tom Sixkiller opined

"Ash Wyllie" wrote in message
...
Peter Gottlieb opined

"Tom Sixkiller" wrote in message
...

"Mike Rapoport" wrote in message
nk.net...
When it is profitable enough then more refining capacity will be
built.

Don't think so. Couldn't do it if they if they wanted to. If the regs
were
"relaxed", it would still be prohibitive after the cost of dealing with
the
regs were amortized.


If refining is so incredibly expensive here then why isn't the refining
being done where it is cheaper and the final product shipped here for
consumption?

WE are importing refined products from Europe and Venezuala. 10 or 20%,
IIRC.
But it is an inflexible pipeline, and some overseas refineries are not
willing
to upgrade in order to produce the latest EPA mandated concoctions.

The logical conclusion is that refining here, with all the regulations,
is
still economically favorable as compared to refining elsewhere.

The conclusion might be at the end of your previous paragraph.

I've heard that US refineries are operating at damn near 100% of ALLOWED
capacity. Can anyone verify that?


It is 90%+ of installed capacity. Which leaves very little room for error.

In 1981, according to the National Petrochemical and Refiners Association,
321 refineries pumped out 18.6 million barrels a day of gasoline. Today
only 149 refineries, run by 60 companies in 33 different states, pump out
16.8 million barrels of gasoline daily - almost 2 million barrels a day
less. They are operating at 93 percent of capacity, well above the
industrial average, with little time left for maintenance and upgrades.

Tom Bray, Washington Times


-ash
Cthulhu for President!
Why vote for a lesser evil?

"Ash Wyllie" wrote in message
...
I've heard that US refineries are operating at damn near 100% of ALLOWED
capacity. Can anyone verify that?


It is 90%+ of installed capacity. Which leaves very little room for error.

In 1981, according to the National Petrochemical and Refiners
Association,
321 refineries pumped out 18.6 million barrels a day of gasoline. Today
only 149 refineries, run by 60 companies in 33 different states, pump
out
16.8 million barrels of gasoline daily - almost 2 million barrels a day
less. They are operating at 93 percent of capacity, well above the
industrial average, with little time left for maintenance and upgrades.

Tom Bray, Washington Times

Sounds "damn near" to me.

What about drillings? I recall (my memory started to go longggg before I hit
50) that the only new drillings are off shore, and that is so restricted by
EPA (and other alphabet soup) that it has to be an EXCEPTIONALLY GOOD
reading before they spend the money. Any idea of the ratio of cost of
drilling to cost of government paperwork and bureaucratic BS? :~)