what would you do?

On Mon, 21 Jun 2004 20:45:34 -0700, "Peter Duniho"
wrote:

"zatatime" wrote in message
.. .
It shouldn't matter Who is being reported. How do you know this
person has done something worth reporting? Because of a post on the
internet?

No one is proposing reporting a pilot solely on the basis of what they've
read on this newsgroup. The only person to whom it's being suggested that
the pilot be reported is the person who actually observed the actions.

If that person cannot make a final determination as to whether to report the
person, who can? All we are saying is that if the events transpired as
described, that's a reportable offense. Nothing more, nothing less.
And that person is using input from this group as a barometer for his
actions. When strong opinions are shared from people he may trust
those opinions weigh more heavily into the equation than random
comments. If the people making those opinions were not there to
witness it they really don't know what transpired.


It's almost as if no one here has ever made a mistake, and that they
are as close to perfect pilots as anyone can be.

I have no idea where you got that impression. Perhaps you could quote some
posts that led you to it. It sure seems like you pulled that conclusion out
of your ass, given the utter lack of supporting statements within this
thread to justify it.

From time to time we see a "What Would You Do" type of post.
Generally the crowd chants Take Action with the Feds. This opinion
did not come out of my ass at all, but is based on what I have seen
here over time. I don't live for usenet (although I use it regularly)
so I'm not going to research history for the sake of sharing an
opinion. It wouldn't be time well spent.

Don't take it so personally.

z

True but calling the FSDO is just beginning a process of reviewing whether
the pilot in question is qualified to be flying or needs more training.
Based on the information presented, I think a review is warranted. Just my
humble opinion.

Mike
MU-2

"zatatime" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 21 Jun 2004 20:45:34 -0700, "Peter Duniho"
wrote:

"zatatime" wrote in message
.. .
It shouldn't matter Who is being reported. How do you know this
person has done something worth reporting? Because of a post on the
internet?

No one is proposing reporting a pilot solely on the basis of what they've
read on this newsgroup. The only person to whom it's being suggested that
the pilot be reported is the person who actually observed the actions.

If that person cannot make a final determination as to whether to report
the
person, who can? All we are saying is that if the events transpired as
described, that's a reportable offense. Nothing more, nothing less.
And that person is using input from this group as a barometer for his
actions. When strong opinions are shared from people he may trust
those opinions weigh more heavily into the equation than random
comments. If the people making those opinions were not there to
witness it they really don't know what transpired.


It's almost as if no one here has ever made a mistake, and that they
are as close to perfect pilots as anyone can be.

I have no idea where you got that impression. Perhaps you could quote
some
posts that led you to it. It sure seems like you pulled that conclusion
out
of your ass, given the utter lack of supporting statements within this
thread to justify it.

From time to time we see a "What Would You Do" type of post.
Generally the crowd chants Take Action with the Feds. This opinion
did not come out of my ass at all, but is based on what I have seen
here over time. I don't live for usenet (although I use it regularly)
so I'm not going to research history for the sake of sharing an
opinion. It wouldn't be time well spent.

Don't take it so personally.

z

"zatatime" wrote in message
...
And that person is using input from this group as a barometer for his
actions.

And yet, we are not the ones making the decision. Whatever happened to
personal responsibility? Oh, that's right...there's no such thing anymore.

[...] If the people making those opinions were not there to
witness it they really don't know what transpired.

If the people making those opinions WERE there, they could take action
themselves, rather than providing insight to someone else who WAS there. By
your logic, no one should ever seek counsel from someone else. That's a
pretty dumb conclusion, IMHO.

From time to time we see a "What Would You Do" type of post.
Generally the crowd chants Take Action with the Feds.

Yes, it does, now and then. So?

This opinion
did not come out of my ass at all, but is based on what I have seen
here over time.

How do you conclude from recommendations that dangerous behavior be reported
to the FAA, that "no one here has ever made a mistake"? The two are
completely unrelated.

Your statement that "no one here has ever made a mistake" did indeed come
right out of your ass. It's a completely unjustified conclusion. No one
here ever claimed that they never made a mistake (well, perhaps excepting
one particular trollish controller), nor do comments suggesting a dangerous
pilot be reported imply any such thing.

Pete

"zatatime" wrote in message
...

I really am amazed at how quickly this group seems to hang people and
almost unanimously declare that someone should be referred to the
authorities when all they really have to go by is one persons opinion.

According to the original post, there were quite a few witnesses.

It's almost as if no one here has ever made a mistake, and that they
are as close to perfect pilots as anyone can be.

Not that boneheaded of mistakes.

On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 05:53:15 -0700, "Tom Sixkiller"
wrote:

According to the original post, there were quite a few witnesses.

None of whom frequent this group, which still leaves us making a
determination (suggestion) based one one person's point of view.

It's almost as if no one here has ever made a mistake, and that they
are as close to perfect pilots as anyone can be.

Not that boneheaded of mistakes.

Are you sure, No One who has Ever posted here has not made One
significant error? Just seems too absolute a statement to me.

"zatatime" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 05:53:15 -0700, "Tom Sixkiller"
wrote:

According to the original post, there were quite a few witnesses.

None of whom frequent this group, which still leaves us making a
determination (suggestion) based one one person's point of view.

I didn't know we were expected to make a determination, only a WAG as to
what he should do: report, or not report. I expect $12 a day if I gotta do
Jury Duty.

It's almost as if no one here has ever made a mistake, and that they
are as close to perfect pilots as anyone can be.

Not that boneheaded of mistakes.

Are you sure, No One who has Ever posted here has not made One
significant error? Just seems too absolute a statement to me.

We're all still alive, aren't we? Mostly?

"zatatime" wrote in message

I really am amazed at how quickly this group seems to hang people and
almost unanimously declare that someone should be referred to the
authorities when all they really have to go by is one persons opinion.

Well, that's why we're just talking about it here and not calling the FAA,
isn't it?

If I saw it, I would have probably reported it because somebody like me, or
my family, or my CFI or friends who fly, or the offending pilot and her
passengers, might be in grave danger.
Similarly, as an avid boater on the Columbia River, I do not hesitate to
report flagrantly irresponsible activity by other boaters when I see them
put other people in harm's way.

-c

"Michael 182" wrote in message

What does "report her" mean? Why should the FSDO care what I say when
I
"report" a fellow pilot?

They are the ones in charge of enforcing the FARs.

Right, but it is my word against hers. Why should they believe me?

Because other people might have reported her too. If not, at least you made
a best effort instead of shrugging the whole thing off and hoping somebody
doesn't get killed by her irresponsibility next time.

Here's an anecdote. In 1990 or so, a Lake flew under the bridges in
downtown Portland, Oregon in the middle of the day, and the FAA and police
were looking all over for the guy. I saw a Lake that fit the exact
description sitting outside a hangar at TTD, having just landed, that very
day. Didn't report it, although Lake amphibs are pretty rare out here.
Should I have reported it?

-c

"gatt" wrote in message
...

"Michael 182" wrote in message

What does "report her" mean? Why should the FSDO care what I say
when
I
"report" a fellow pilot?

They are the ones in charge of enforcing the FARs.

Right, but it is my word against hers. Why should they believe me?

Because other people might have reported her too. If not, at least you
made
a best effort instead of shrugging the whole thing off and hoping somebody
doesn't get killed by her irresponsibility next time.

Here's an anecdote. In 1990 or so, a Lake flew under the bridges in
downtown Portland, Oregon in the middle of the day, and the FAA and police
were looking all over for the guy. I saw a Lake that fit the exact
description sitting outside a hangar at TTD, having just landed, that very
day. Didn't report it, although Lake amphibs are pretty rare out here.
Should I have reported it?

Absolutely not. You don't know it was the same Lake. You don't even know it
was a Lake that flew under the bridge (other than someone else's ID, which,
unless it was by a pilot is pretty iffy). You don't know the circumstances
of flying under the bridge, if in fact, that really happened. Maybe he was
landing legitimately and taxiied under the bridge. I have no idea what the
seaplane rules are, do you? And, aside from everything else, I really have
no problem with someone flying under a bridge. I wouldn't do it, but
barnstormers used to do this sort of thing all the time.

Michael




-c

"gatt" wrote in message
...
[...] Didn't report it, although Lake amphibs are pretty rare out here.

Funny you should say that. The Pacific Northwest (in which I include the
Portland area) is the region with the second-most number of Lake amphibs,
after the southeast US (mainly Florida).

Should I have reported it?

If you didn't see the airplane flying under the bridge, what would there
have been for you to report?

Pete