Letter from Jess Meyers

On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 14:18:14 -0400, Matt Whiting
wrote:

Rich S. wrote:

"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
news:ccramb01ome@enews4.

I never said it was the only straw, but I believe it is the largest
factor by far. If anyone can show me a shred of evidence that humans
have made some dramatic change in genetic composition in the last 3-4
decads, I'll admit that I'm wrong.


Matt, I don't think it has happened in the last 3-4 decades. I don't
think it is a change in genetic composition but a survival of that
genetic composition in the last 300 years.

When food is scarce, those who's body can utilize whatever food is
available will survive. In the livestock industry, such an animal is
known as an easy keeper. It is a trait of some species and some
breeds.

Example: Several studies of Navajo, Pima and Apache Native Americans
have revealed between 45 and 74 percent have type 2 diabetes. A
condition brought on by obesity. The prevalence for obesity was a
result of culling those ancestors who were not "easy keepers" in
difficult times.

Bottom line is the abundance of food for those with "easy keeper"
genetic composition.

Matt Whiting wrote:
Rich S. wrote:

I scrounged through the recycle bin until I found last month's Reader's
Digest (July) and re-read the article on "Beating the Urge to Eat" by
Peter
Jaret. Several interesting items caught my attention.

1. A hormone called leptin signals the brain to supress appetite - "Hey,
Dude, quit eating. You're full!".

2. 85 to 90 percent of obese people DO NOT have a deficiency of leptin.
Their bodies have become resistant to its effects. This is much like
Type II
diabetes where the body has plenty of insulin but is insulin resistant.

3. An excess of triglycerides may contribute to leptin resistance.

4. An enzyme called SCD-1 - controlled by leptin - is used by the body to
create fat cells. Delete the gene that makes SCD-1 (in mice) and they can
pig out on Twinkies and beer without gaining weight.

5. Another culprit that may make you chubby is a virus, AD-36.

6. Base level activity can vary up to 500 calories/day. Notice how some
people constantly twitch? Low or high metabolism is hereditary, but
they're
working on metabolism boosting substances.

The article closes with, "Patients used to blame being overweight on
glands
and hormones, and we doctors would say, 'It's not hormones, it's
calories,'
" says Banks. "Now we know hormones *are* involved." . . ."People can
diet
and lose 10 or 15 pounds. But real obesity isn't a willpower problem,.
It's
a medical problem."


I still don't buy it. If it is a medical problem, why did it just occur
in the last 20-30 years and not 500 or 1000 years ago? I believe it is
our sedentary lifestyle combined with simply eating for recreation
rather than sustenance.


Matt


It's a medical problem that has always existed, but we have become much
more affluent in the past 20 or 30 years. We've gone from an average of
one car per family to three. We go to restaurants where we're served
huge, fatty portions, 'cause nobody would spend $50 for a plate of
boring vegetables and a slice of baloney (what you'd eat if you stayed
at home and fixed it yourself). Millenia of evolution taught us that we
better eat when food is available or you'll starve to death tomorrow.
You've gotta get fat in the summer to survive the winter. The instinct
is still there, but the winter isn't, and neither is the need to chase
the food down.

I've done better with my weight lately as I've started getting out of
the kitchen and into the garage, getting so caught up that I miss a meal
every now and again or just eat a bite so that I can get back to work.
I'll lose weight and have an airplane to boot. 8*)

--
http://www.ernest.isa-geek.org/
"Ignorance is mankinds normal state,
alleviated by information and experience."
Veeduber

Ernest Christley wrote:

Matt Whiting wrote:

Rich S. wrote:

I scrounged through the recycle bin until I found last month's Reader's
Digest (July) and re-read the article on "Beating the Urge to Eat" by
Peter
Jaret. Several interesting items caught my attention.

1. A hormone called leptin signals the brain to supress appetite - "Hey,
Dude, quit eating. You're full!".

2. 85 to 90 percent of obese people DO NOT have a deficiency of leptin.
Their bodies have become resistant to its effects. This is much like
Type II
diabetes where the body has plenty of insulin but is insulin resistant.

3. An excess of triglycerides may contribute to leptin resistance.

4. An enzyme called SCD-1 - controlled by leptin - is used by the
body to
create fat cells. Delete the gene that makes SCD-1 (in mice) and they
can
pig out on Twinkies and beer without gaining weight.

5. Another culprit that may make you chubby is a virus, AD-36.

6. Base level activity can vary up to 500 calories/day. Notice how some
people constantly twitch? Low or high metabolism is hereditary, but
they're
working on metabolism boosting substances.

The article closes with, "Patients used to blame being overweight on
glands
and hormones, and we doctors would say, 'It's not hormones, it's
calories,'
" says Banks. "Now we know hormones *are* involved." . . ."People can
diet
and lose 10 or 15 pounds. But real obesity isn't a willpower
problem,. It's
a medical problem."



I still don't buy it. If it is a medical problem, why did it just
occur in the last 20-30 years and not 500 or 1000 years ago? I
believe it is our sedentary lifestyle combined with simply eating for
recreation rather than sustenance.


Matt


It's a medical problem that has always existed, but we have become much
more affluent in the past 20 or 30 years. We've gone from an average of
one car per family to three. We go to restaurants where we're served
huge, fatty portions, 'cause nobody would spend $50 for a plate of
boring vegetables and a slice of baloney (what you'd eat if you stayed
at home and fixed it yourself). Millenia of evolution taught us that we
better eat when food is available or you'll starve to death tomorrow.
You've gotta get fat in the summer to survive the winter. The instinct
is still there, but the winter isn't, and neither is the need to chase
the food down.

Baloney. We also have a brain that we can use to know that we don't
need to eat like pigs when our waist measurement exceeds our chest
measurement. I really feel sorry for all you folk that are just victims
of the world and circumstances.


Matt

Matt Whiting wrote in
:

Ernest Christley wrote:

Matt Whiting wrote:

It's a medical problem that has always existed, ...

Baloney....


Matt


From: http://pwp.value.net/~fitness/wghtnews.htm#10

"In a study of 11 individuals who were highly resistant to weight loss
while dieting, researchers measured all of these individuals' activity and
food calories for 14 days. The individuals also kept a log of their food
and exercise activities. At the end of the experiment, the research showed
that these individuals under reported their food calories by 47% and over
reported their exercise calories by 51%.

Prior to testing, these individuals believed their inability to lose weight
was due to a low resting metabolic rate and other metabolic factors. They
were distressed to learn tests showed their metabolisms to be normal.

These results are in agreement with many other studies showing individuals
oftentimes mis-report and consequently mis-perceive their actual food
intake and exercise activities."


Rob

Rob, Matt,

Metabolism is one fator, there are many more. Genetics could also
play a role in other things such as behavior or the person's ability
to taste or smell the food and the effect eating certain food has on
them.

I obviously feel that genetics plays a much more significant role than
you do. I can't deny that stomach stapling of fat people results in
much lower caloric intake and significant weight loss. At the same
time, I can't deny that doubling or tripling the caloric intake while
simultaneously reducing carbs to near zero will also result in rapid
weight loss in many people. The effectivness of a low carb / high
calorie diet is well known.

My nonscientific opinion about the low carb mechanism is that I
believe that carbs are a catalyst needed for digesting fat. In my own
experiments, a carb binge while on a low carb diet usually has
disasterous results. In my case, I can eat huge bowls of zero carb
ice cream covered in zero carb chocolate syrup and show a weight loss.
But if I throw a cracker in the works, all bets are off.

With that said, it is also possible that for genetic reasons, some fat
people may simply have more efficient digestive systems. Maybe their
livers secrete some enzyme that mine doesn't - I don't know. But even
if the genetic trait is simply the lack of willpower, then its still a
genetic trait. Obese tendencies run in families - that much is
obvious.

Dennis.

Rob McDonald wrote:

"In a study of 11 individuals who were highly resistant to weight loss

Prior to testing, these individuals believed their inability to lose weight
was due to a low resting metabolic rate and other metabolic factors. They
were distressed to learn tests showed their metabolisms to be normal.

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

On Thu, 15 Jul 2004 02:51:04 GMT, wrote:

Obese tendencies run in families - that much is
obvious.

Often true, but is it genetic or is it learned behavior?

Tiny children of obese parents are often also obese. The infants can
only eat what's in front of them, so if they are obese, it's because
the parents are feeding them too much. Habits learned at an early age
are very difficult to unlearn.

The children have their obese parents as role models. If the parents
are obese, why would the children think it's not normal?

I think this is mostly learned behavior, not genetics.

Corky Scott

On Thu, 15 Jul 2004 02:51:04 +0000, n4mwd.dont.spam.me wrote:

f the genetic trait is simply the lack of willpower, then its still a
genetic trait. Obese tendencies run in families - that much is
obvious.

What's obvious is that obese people feed their kids too much food as well.
I can look to my own family for that info. At my Father in Law's he's
always pushing more food towards you, much in excess of the normal amount
you should consume. Of course he eats a lot of food and considers it
normal and anybody who doesn't eat as much as him needs more. That's how
it works.

Those who cry GENETICS are those who do not have the will power to do a
proper diet. I admit there are those who truly do have medical problems,
but not all that cry it.

Lets use you for an example because I already posted my info, how many
calories do you consume in a day before and during your diet now?

Rob McDonald wrote:

Matt Whiting wrote in
:


Ernest Christley wrote:


Matt Whiting wrote:

It's a medical problem that has always existed, ...

Baloney....


Matt



From: http://pwp.value.net/~fitness/wghtnews.htm#10

"In a study of 11 individuals who were highly resistant to weight loss
while dieting, researchers measured all of these individuals' activity and
food calories for 14 days. The individuals also kept a log of their food
and exercise activities. At the end of the experiment, the research showed
that these individuals under reported their food calories by 47% and over
reported their exercise calories by 51%.

Prior to testing, these individuals believed their inability to lose weight
was due to a low resting metabolic rate and other metabolic factors. They
were distressed to learn tests showed their metabolisms to be normal.

These results are in agreement with many other studies showing individuals
oftentimes mis-report and consequently mis-perceive their actual food
intake and exercise activities."


Rob

Yep, you simply can't argue the physics and chemistry. Even a very
efficient body, still needs a certain number of calories to keep itself
warm. If you cut back on the calories far enough, you WILL lose weight!
There is simply no way to avoid it. The hard part is cutting back the
calories and/or increasing the calorie consumption. At least it is hard
for me.


Matt

Something I have found useful for controlling diet is the DietPower PC
program.
www.dietpower.com

You set up a target weight reduction schedule, log food eaten and exercise
taken along with daily weight records. It continually adjusts for your
metabolic rate from this info to give you target calorie intake to track the
weight reduction schedule.

Works for me- information is everything.

There is also a similar program for Palms- EatIt.

Stuart (enjoying the free additional 5hp) Parker
ZK-JAW Airborne Edge 582
www.sparxfly.co.nz

4. An enzyme called SCD-1 - controlled by leptin - is used by the body to
create fat cells. Delete the gene that makes SCD-1 (in mice) and they can
pig out on Twinkies and beer without gaining weight.

Haaaaa!

Thats me to a "T"

Eat, drink ANYTHING I want and never gain a pound!

Eat (your low carb) hearts out guys

Of course looking like a mouse doesnt help the dating scene though

take care

Blll