Have you ever...

"Peter Duniho" wrote:
Be careful about your generalizations. In the scenario you describe, I see
no reason to accept a ride. But there are plenty of examples of passengers
who are total strangers to the pilot accepting rides, as are there examples
of taking car rides from total strangers, all in very reasonable, accepted
situations.

I didn't make any generalizations. In the scenario described, I knew
*nothing* about this person, not even his name, and he was not an
acquaintance of anyone I knew ... just a man driving through the airport.

I don't know what examples there are of people taking car rides or plane
rides from total strangers--no one I know gets into a car with a person
they don't even know. I'm not talking about taxicab drivers, limo
drivers, courtesy rides from maintenance shops, charter pilots or CFIs
doing Discovery Flights...that's a completely different scenario where
the passenger has initiated the ride/flight as part of a service they
are paying for. I was talking about a total stranger assuming you would
have no qualms about hopping into an airplane with him.

Jay Honeck wrote:
...refused to fly with someone you felt was not entirely safe? (With that
person acting as PIC, not as a passenger in your own plane.)

Absolutely !! And the guy was a good friend too. After a rather heated
discussion he ended up taking remedial training.

We don't speak much anymore...but he's still alive and, more
importantly, so am I ! ;-)


Toño

I fly often with an older gentleman who, although a private pilot, has
some shortcomings. He can't seem to figure out cross-wind takeoffs
and/or landings.
I don't just refuse to fly with him, I take the time to gently try to
keep him in the air, where he belongs. There have been occasions where
I have taken the controls from him, again in such a manner as to help
him.
I have another friend who, when his son was killed in Viet Nam, tried
to commit suicide. He noted this on his subsequent medical and we all
know what happened next.
He can only fly when I will go with him and act as the pilot in
command. He is a marginal pilot, but he still gets to fly.

If one is not a pilot, and gets into an airplane with an incompetent
pilot; well, that person takes his/her chances.

If one is a pilot, and someone does a poor or no pre-flight, and then
flies in such a manner as to endanger one, and does/says nothing,
there is no reason to complain about it.

And please don't tell me that you are too intimidated to speak up or
take the controls if the pilot is misbehaving. Reading the posts on
this board convinces me you are all type A personalities who would
never meekly let someone kill them.



On Sun, 10 Apr 2005 00:41:44 -0700, Toño
wrote:

Jay Honeck wrote:
...refused to fly with someone you felt was not entirely safe? (With that
person acting as PIC, not as a passenger in your own plane.)

Absolutely !! And the guy was a good friend too. After a rather heated
discussion he ended up taking remedial training.

We don't speak much anymore...but he's still alive and, more
importantly, so am I ! ;-)


Toño

wrote in message

Reading the posts on this board convinces me you are all type A
personalities who would
never meekly let someone kill them.

Well, I'm decidedly type C.

There's people I won't take flying with me; I'd have no reservations balking
(politely) at a flight in which I wasn't comfortable with the pilot.

If a friend were flying and I thought they were doing something unsafe, I'd
find a constructive way to tell them my concern. If it may save their life,
it's no different than offering them a hand or throwing them a line if they
fell over the side of a boat. They're better off alive and hot then dead
and cold.

-c

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:X%16e.33363$NW5.4119@attbi_s02...
...refused to fly with someone you felt was not entirely safe? (With that
person acting as PIC, not as a passenger in your own plane.)

I had it happen earlier this year, for the first time, ever, and it felt,
well, weird.

I think I did the right thing, but it's hard to say. That funny little
voice in my head just kept saying "stay on the ground..." -- so I did.

Never heard that voice before.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

I've never been invited up by a pilot I wouldn't fly with, but I have been
invited to ride along in airplanes I wouldn't fly in. Homebuilt helicopters
come to mind, as does an offer of a ride in a '47 Bonanza which was known to
have serious corrosion problems in the flight control skins as well as
wiring with crumbling insulation. I figured those things were the tips of
the iceberg with that Bonanza...

My experience was actually a combination of factors.

- The aircraft was a high-performance home-built (not built by the
current owner)
- The pilot had recently purchased the aircraft
- The pilot has an aggressive, somewhat unpredictable personality
- I'd flown with this pilot before, and was taken aback at the way they
skated on radio and standard pattern procedures.
- The weather was predicted to be marginal along the route of flight

For the first time, ever, I felt better staying on the ground.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay,

Good call. Reading your list, I'd say any any 2 of these would be more
than enough to justify not going along on the flight. I wouldn't have
gone either.

Regards,

Fred G. Black, PP-ASEL,G Sundowner C-FJQG @ CYOW
18 Perrin Ave Phone: (613) 823-6017
Nepean, ON, K2J 2Y4 Email:

Jay Honeck wrote:
My experience was actually a combination of factors.

- The aircraft was a high-performance home-built (not built by the
current owner)
- The pilot had recently purchased the aircraft
- The pilot has an aggressive, somewhat unpredictable personality
- I'd flown with this pilot before, and was taken aback at the way they
skated on radio and standard pattern procedures.
- The weather was predicted to be marginal along the route of flight

For the first time, ever, I felt better staying on the ground.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message

Yes, my first CFI-I.

He was a hot dog. I flew with him twice and then quit him.

A few weeks later he was trying to show someone how close to the threshold
he could put the wheels on landing. He came up a few feet short and badly
damaged the aircraft and his career, but fortunately no ones health.

Jay,
It has happened to me a couple of times. I have not seen any of them in
a long time.
Having hours and confidence does help knowing I can take the controls if
necessary.
Michelle

Jay Honeck wrote:

...refused to fly with someone you felt was not entirely safe? (With that
person acting as PIC, not as a passenger in your own plane.)

I had it happen earlier this year, for the first time, ever, and it felt,
well, weird.

I think I did the right thing, but it's hard to say. That funny little
voice in my head just kept saying "stay on the ground..." -- so I did.

Never heard that voice before.

"Michelle P" wrote in message Having hours and confidence does help
knowing I can take the controls if necessary.

What if the PIC scoffs at your concerns and does not relinquish the controls
to you?

D.