Time, running out of fuel and fuel gauges

Thanks for the correction.
--
Gene Seibel
Gene & Sue's Aeroplanes - http://pad39a.com/gene/planes.html
Because we fly, we envy no one.

Before you get too excited about FAR part 23, remember most of the planes we fly were certified under CAR 3, and don't have to conform to part 23 regarding fuel gauges. Only newer aircraft certified under part 23 have to conform to this regulation.

That's not to say that it isn't a very good idea to get your gauges calibrated and make them as accurate as possible. And if your fuel gauge says empty, then land ASAP and figure out the problem.

John


[quote=Bob Moore;269828]"Gene Seibel" wrote

The only regulations for fuel gauges are that they read correctly at
empty. They are not reliable for determining the amount of fuel in the
tanks, but as they approach empty, they should be believed.

Bull****! I am repeating an e-mail that I sent to a young man
who posted the same information on his web site.

Russ......

I stumbled on your web site while searching for some C-172 Fuel Cap
information.
I found the following statement which while completely false, seems to be
circulating quite widely.

"The FAA only requires the gauges to read accurately when the tanks are
empty. Yeah, you're right, that's really stupid, but it's the law."

I have quoted the applicable portion of the Federal Aviation Regulation
"law".

Section 23.1337: Powerplant instruments installation.
(b) Fuel quantity indication. There must be a means to indicate to the
flightcrew members
the quantity of usable fuel in each tank during flight. An indicator
calibrated in appropriate units and clearly marked to indicate those
units must be used. In addition:

(1) Each fuel quantity indicator must be calibrated to read "zero" during
level flight when
the quantity of fuel remaining in the tank is equal to the unusable fuel
supply determined under §23.959(a.......

Gene Seibel wrote:
The only regulations for fuel gauges are that they read correctly at
empty.

No, the regs also require that they indicate the quantity of fuel in the tank.
All the time.

George Patterson
There's plenty of room for all of God's creatures. Right next to the
mashed potatoes.

My mistake. Thanks for pointing it out.
--
Gene Seibel
Hangar 131 - http://pad39a.com/gene/plane.html
Because I fly, I envy no one.

The cherokee series has a fairly prounounced wing dihedral. If the
airplane is parked on a non-level surface, it's possible for the lower
tank to appear full when in fact it can be a good half hour short of
full.

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
A couple of points with regard to running out of fuel:


Question for all: how accurate are fuel flow meters?

Ed H wrote:
Question for all: how accurate are fuel flow meters?

The Cherokee Six I fly has an FS450.
It had been installed for over a year and never calibrated.
After a trip to AirVenture in 2001 with a fuel flow on the guage of 16
gph, imagine my surprise when the fuel truck upload calculated out to 12
gph!
A series of four flights over the next couple months resulted in
tweaking the calibration to where a three hour trip showed only a 0.6
gallon difference between actual fuel used and calculated fuel used.
I couldn't adjust it any better than that.

Ed H wrote:

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
A couple of points with regard to running out of fuel:


Question for all: how accurate are fuel flow meters?

I have a JPI EDM-800 engine monitor installed in my Bonanza and its fuel
flow meter is accurate to less than 1 gallon per three hour flight. The
JPI reads one gallon less than there really is in the tanks after a three
hour flight. The JPI also has a programmable alarm that will flash time
remaining when time reaches a preset limit. I set it to one hour
remaining., which is the upper limit of the alarm.

Regarding accuracy, there is a method for adjusting the k-factor in this
instrument that would allow me to get the fuel flow even more accurate, but
I have yet to do this.

Another nice feature of the JPI is that it feeds fuel flow and fuel
remaining data to the Garmin GNS430. This allows me to go to the Fuel
Planning page of the GPS to see an actual landing fuel, fuel to next
waypoint, fuel needed for remaining trip, and time remaining (endurance).

Of course, the GIGO factor applies here (garbage in, garbage out). The JPI
needs to be told how much fuel is on board. If the pilot fails to
initialize the instrument with the actual FOB, the fuel remaining and
endurance will obviously be incorrect.

--
Peter


















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"Ed H" wrote in message
. ..
Question for all: how accurate are fuel flow meters?

I have a very simple one, shows only current fuel flow, and total fuel used
since the last reset. I don't even recall what brand it is.

My experience with it is much more like Peter R.'s than John Smith's. It's
extremely accurate, and consistently predicts how much fuel will be required
to top off the tanks to less than a gallon (to within 0.5 gallon is
typical).

Pete

Pete et al
With all due respect for the modern electronics and advancements, I
guess I am just one of the soon to be gone dinosaurs and have seen all
too many occasions when the modern technology takes a vacation when you
need it most. Reliance on anything electrical with little regard for
anything else in the way of aviation aids is, to my mind, just another
example of an unexplained NTSB report in the making.
I flew for many years in remote areas without anything but common sense
and the teachings of an old CFI who was very demanding and required
that I knew our exact location at any given time, and give him the
number of gallons we'd take on at refueling. I smile to think of how
easy it would have been if we'd had GPS for an aid. We didn't even have
ADF in many regions and in many cases no accurate charts.
Lovely to have the modern technology working, but it will never replace
the human brain. The human brain is useless unless it has the proper
knowledge to work with.
My point is to not rely solely on electrical components/indications.
Fly safe
Ol S&B