At last, the truth...

Jay Honeck wrote:
There's no mystery to me as to why not everyone loves aviation like we do
(or why some people love golf like I don't!).


Right. But these "near-pilots" DID love aviation like we do -- and
something spooked them to the point where they walked away.

I used to play golf several times a week, had my handicap down to 5.
Then I lost interest so I quit. I played twice this summer. I have a
ham radio license, the highest one you can get, the extra class. I got
the first one in 1985. By summer 1988 I had worked nearly 190 countries
with a pretty modest setup at my folks house. Then I got married and I
pretty much haven't turned a radio on since and really don't miss it.
Although I just ordered up the new Vertex handheld that is an aviation
Nav/Comm and a 2 meter ham transceiver. I do have a 2 meter radio at my
computer here with an antenna up on the roof but I mostly set it up
because it has the aviation band on it. I occasionally plug in the
handheld and BS with some flying buddies on 122.75. I don't forsee
losing interest in flying but you never know. I sure would like a cabin
on a lake.

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:3gULe.251379$x96.181434@attbi_s72...
[...]
It was with a heavy heart and a feeling of dismay that I bid our guest
farewell. Perhaps it was for the best that he quit flying, but I couldn't
help but think that he had given up too soon, and that with a little extra
guidance he could have made a good pilot.

He probably would have. I don't think many students, having just soloed,
would have done as well as he did during the bean field incident.

That said, not every ex-pilot's situation is the same, and just because you
can't imagine quitting flying over something more mundane, that doesn't mean
other pilots wouldn't either. We are NOT all cut from the same cloth, as
numerous off-topic discussions in this newsgroup ought to demonstrate quite
well.

Speaking from my own personal experience, flying is something I've always
wanted to do. Ever since I was a little kid, but it never occurred to me
until after college it was something I *could* do. Then I dove right in.

I still love flying. But my life is different these days. I've got a plane
I can hardly find time to use. I never did fit my lifestyle around it the
way I wanted to (it's an amphib, that hardly sees the water these days). On
top of that, other than the majority of the 600,000 or so pilots in the US,
the rest of the country is doing everything it can to simply end general
aviation. (And I find it sad that even some of that group of licensed
pilots are helping this "cause" to end aviation).

I'm normally capable of being a pretty stubborn guy, but especially as I get
older, I find I am less able to be stubborn about as wide a range of things
at one time, and I do have plenty else in my life to be stubborn about.
Quite frankly, between my own personal circumstance and what I view as a
trend toward making aviation just not worth the trouble, I have had thoughts
about just giving the whole thing up.

I relate all this simply to point out the wide variety of individual
situations that may lead to a person quitting flying. Granted, I haven't
done it yet...but I sure feel closer to doing so than I ever have, and
that's counting when I had my medical issues a few years ago (when major
surgery was the only way for me to get my medical back). Nothing's scared
me, and I feel I'm every bit a pilot as anyone else I know. But it's just
hard to see how flying fits well into my life right now.

If this "conversation" is anything like any of the others we've had in the
past, you won't understand what I'm feeling or thinking here either.

I think it's highly unlikely that your "sense" of a hidden, "life-changing
event" is accurate in most cases. I suspect that most people tell you what
they believe to be the actual reasons for giving up flying. It's just how
life is...not everyone feels exactly the way you do about flying, even
though they may be very good pilots themselves. Just because you can't
relate to their reasons, that doesn't mean their reasons aren't just as they
say.

Pete

I'm normally capable of being a pretty stubborn guy, but especially as I
get older, I find I am less able to be stubborn about as wide a range of
things at one time, and I do have plenty else in my life to be stubborn
about.

You, Pete? No way!

:-)

Quite frankly, between my own personal circumstance and what I view as a
trend toward making aviation just not worth the trouble, I have had
thoughts about just giving the whole thing up.

I hope it doesn't come to that.

Speaking from my own personal experience, flying is something I've always
wanted to do. Ever since I was a little kid, but it never occurred to me
until after college it was something I *could* do. Then I dove right in.

Heck, you figured it out 14 years faster than I did. I kick myself daily
for not realizing what was possible until I was 35.

If this "conversation" is anything like any of the others we've had in the
past, you won't understand what I'm feeling or thinking here either.

No, what you say makes perfect sense.

I think it's highly unlikely that your "sense" of a hidden, "life-changing
event" is accurate in most cases. I suspect that most people tell you
what they believe to be the actual reasons for giving up flying.

I don't know. But I guess if a pilot is able to "give up" flying *without*
some sort of a life-changing scary experience, then, perhaps, they were
never really that hooked on it in the first place? This is another concept
I cannot understand -- how can someone fly without becoming hooked on the
magic of flight? -- so perhaps I'll never be able to fathom these folks.

Flying is *not* golf, nor boating, nor motorcycling, nor anything else.
Quite simply, there is nothing else like it; so quitting -- for me --
someday, is going to be ugly, and entirely involuntary.

To simply relinquish the ability to fly of my own free will is unthinkable,
and -- since it's hard to B.S. a B.S.-er -- I always search for deeper
reasons when someone tells me they quit flying because of "the wife" or "the
job".
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Flying is *not* golf, nor boating, nor motorcycling, nor anything else.
Quite simply, there is nothing else like it; so quitting -- for me --
someday, is going to be ugly, and entirely involuntary.

You have it backwards. Motorcycling is *not* golf, nor flying, nor
boating... but I bet you just don't "get it" when it comes to two-wheelers.

What (except "my God is bigger than your God") is the difference?

Jose
--
Quantum Mechanics is like this: God =does= play dice with the universe,
except there's no God, and there's no dice. And maybe there's no universe.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

You have it backwards. Motorcycling is *not* golf, nor flying, nor
boating... but I bet you just don't "get it" when it comes to
two-wheelers.

What, you're saying *motorcycling* is the be-all and end-all activity?

I've ridden for 20 years, and (IMHO) it is VERY similar to flying. I love
it dearly, but it is essentially just 2/3s of what flying is -- minus the
third dimension.

Until you can pull back on the handlebars and have the cycle go up, there
will be no comparison.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote

I've ridden for 20 years, and (IMHO) it is VERY similar to flying. I love
it dearly, but it is essentially just 2/3s of what flying is -- minus the
third dimension.

Until you can pull back on the handlebars and have the cycle go up, there
will be no comparison.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !

Hey, wait a minute.... I think you may be on to something.

Let's see, some wings unfold out of the front wind fairing, a horizontal
pops out of the saddle bags... the prop could be folded along the back
fender, then opened and engaged....

I'll get back to you on this one... VBG
--
Jim in NC

"Jay Honeck" wrote in news:JCcMe.31172$084.14248
@attbi_s22:

You have it backwards. Motorcycling is *not* golf, nor flying, nor
boating... but I bet you just don't "get it" when it comes to
two-wheelers.

What, you're saying *motorcycling* is the be-all and end-all activity?

I've ridden for 20 years, and (IMHO) it is VERY similar to flying. I love
it dearly, but it is essentially just 2/3s of what flying is -- minus the
third dimension.

Until you can pull back on the handlebars and have the cycle go up, there
will be no comparison.

I've always felt motorcycle riding was like flying at zero AGL.

When you're riding the streets and freeways around LA, it's like
combat at zero AGL. The enemy uses their vehicles as weapons and
your only defense is superior maneuverability.

Brian
--
http://www.skywise711.com - Lasers, Seismology, Astronomy, Skepticism

Seismic FAQ: http://www.skywise711.com/SeismicFAQ/SeismicFAQ.html
Blog: http://www.skywise711.com/Blog

Sed quis custodiet ipsos Custodes?

Jay Honeck wrote:

You have it backwards. Motorcycling is *not* golf, nor flying, nor

boating... but I bet you just don't "get it" when it comes to
two-wheelers.


What, you're saying *motorcycling* is the be-all and end-all activity?

I've ridden for 20 years, and (IMHO) it is VERY similar to flying. I love
it dearly, but it is essentially just 2/3s of what flying is -- minus the
third dimension.

Until you can pull back on the handlebars and have the cycle go up, there
will be no comparison.

I agree that flying is a greater pure thrill than motorcycling and I
have more than 30 years of motorcycling and approaching 30 years of
flying. However, since I live 40 minutes from the nearest airport, it
is much easier to walk down to my garage and take a spin on the bike
when I have a spare couple of hours, than it is to spend 1.5 of those
hours driving to and from the airport for a 30 minute hop.

And a motorcycle provides, as you say, maybe 2/3 rds of the thrill for
about 1/10 the money so it is a pretty good deal! :-)


Matt

"Jay Honeck" writes:
Flying is *not* golf, nor boating, nor motorcycling, nor anything else.
Quite simply, there is nothing else like it; so quitting -- for me --
someday, is going to be ugly, and entirely involuntary.

Back when I was into rock climbing, I quite regularly met folks who
felt that way about the sport. It is all just what you are in to...

Chris
--
Chris Colohan Email: PGP: finger
Web: www.colohan.com Phone: (412)268-4751

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:ag0Me.28191$084.26229@attbi_s22...
[...]
I don't know. But I guess if a pilot is able to "give up" flying
*without* some sort of a life-changing scary experience, then, perhaps,
they were never really that hooked on it in the first place?

But this is what I'm trying to explain to you. I know few pilots who love
flying more than I do. I know they are out there, but I still feel the
passion, and I'm sure it equals or betters that held by most. Yet, I am
still capable of contemplating quitting.

Granted, I haven't done it yet. And perhaps my passion WILL prevent me from
doing so. But I personally believe that even being able to contemplate it
suggests that I'm capable of it.

Of course, you could go with the tautological approach, and define "never
really that hooked on it in the first place" as meaning "is able to give up
flying without some sort of life-changing scary experience". But as with
all tautologies, that doesn't get you any closer to actually understanding
each pilot who gives it up.

This is another concept I cannot understand -- how can someone fly without
becoming hooked on the magic of flight? -- so perhaps I'll never be able
to fathom these folks.

As Jose already pointed out, there are people who become equally hooked on
the magic of other pursuits. There is nothing unique about flying that
makes it somehow better than other hobbies, except of course to those of us
that *believe* it to be better than other hobbies.

Flying is *not* golf, nor boating, nor motorcycling, nor anything else.

Golf is not flying, nor boating, nor motorcycling, nor anything else.

Boating is not golf, nor flying, nor motorcycline, nor anything else.

Motorcycling is not golf, nor boating, nor flying, nor anything else.

The above is equally valid for the infinite number of other things that
people develop a passion for. The fact is, each person has their own unique
outlook on what makes life all worthwhile. For any given pursuit, there's a
person out there that feels that pursuit is what gives them breath, that
that pursuit is the pinnacle of human achievement and demonstrates the very
best of humanity in a single activity. And for most of those people, they
view aviation as just another hobby, nothing special or magical at all.

It's not at all hard for me to imagine a person who tried out flying, and
perhaps even found it enjoyable enough to keep at it for awhile, but who
eventually decided there were other, more important things they needed or
wanted to do.

[...]
To simply relinquish the ability to fly of my own free will is
unthinkable, and -- since it's hard to B.S. a B.S.-er -- I always search
for deeper reasons when someone tells me they quit flying because of "the
wife" or "the job".

People imagine in others their own worst qualities. When you're a
"B.S.-er", it's hard to imagine that there are lots of people out there who
don't B.S. at all.

Pete